ᐅ Air-to-water heat pump combined with underfloor heating is not functioning properly
Created on: 22 Sep 2021 15:34
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_Ugeen_
Hello everyone,
We moved into our single-family house in the middle of the year and are now using our air-to-water heat pump (Daikin Altherma 3 R ECH2O) for the first time. In the rooms, we decided against the standard analog controllers and chose digital controllers instead. After several discussions with Daikin and the controller manufacturer, I now understand that a valve is only opened or closed when I want to increase the temperature or not.
With the Daikin system, I can set a target room temperature. According to Daikin, this target value does not represent the minimum temperature per room but rather the "preheating value," if I understand correctly. This value was previously set at 23°C (73°F).
In the bedroom, I set the digital controller so that heating only starts when the temperature drops below 18°C (64°F). Despite this setting, the room temperature has always been 22-23°C (72-73°F), although the digital controller shows that heating is off. After changing the target room temperature from 23 to 21°C (73 to 70°F), it got a bit cooler. However, in the bathroom, heating is supposed to activate below 23°C (73°F). The temperature there is 22°C (72°F), and the digital controller indicates that heating is active. Yet, the room does not get warmer, and the floor heating does not noticeably warm up either.
Conclusion: I still have not understood the logic behind the target room temperature setting. In our previous apartment, we also had underfloor heating with analog controllers that I could adjust higher or lower. That worked wonderfully, and I felt like I could control the temperature. Here, with the air-to-water heat pump, I don’t have that feeling. Also, the towel warmers do not get truly warm (only lukewarm), which Daikin says is normal even when the dial is set to 5. This is apparently because it is a low-temperature heat pump. Without the electric booster to warm the towel warmers, they are essentially ineffective. Is this normal? Could there be an error, or do I need to use completely different settings?
If anyone has experience with this topic, I would greatly appreciate your feedback. At the moment, I feel a bit lost on this subject.
We moved into our single-family house in the middle of the year and are now using our air-to-water heat pump (Daikin Altherma 3 R ECH2O) for the first time. In the rooms, we decided against the standard analog controllers and chose digital controllers instead. After several discussions with Daikin and the controller manufacturer, I now understand that a valve is only opened or closed when I want to increase the temperature or not.
With the Daikin system, I can set a target room temperature. According to Daikin, this target value does not represent the minimum temperature per room but rather the "preheating value," if I understand correctly. This value was previously set at 23°C (73°F).
In the bedroom, I set the digital controller so that heating only starts when the temperature drops below 18°C (64°F). Despite this setting, the room temperature has always been 22-23°C (72-73°F), although the digital controller shows that heating is off. After changing the target room temperature from 23 to 21°C (73 to 70°F), it got a bit cooler. However, in the bathroom, heating is supposed to activate below 23°C (73°F). The temperature there is 22°C (72°F), and the digital controller indicates that heating is active. Yet, the room does not get warmer, and the floor heating does not noticeably warm up either.
Conclusion: I still have not understood the logic behind the target room temperature setting. In our previous apartment, we also had underfloor heating with analog controllers that I could adjust higher or lower. That worked wonderfully, and I felt like I could control the temperature. Here, with the air-to-water heat pump, I don’t have that feeling. Also, the towel warmers do not get truly warm (only lukewarm), which Daikin says is normal even when the dial is set to 5. This is apparently because it is a low-temperature heat pump. Without the electric booster to warm the towel warmers, they are essentially ineffective. Is this normal? Could there be an error, or do I need to use completely different settings?
If anyone has experience with this topic, I would greatly appreciate your feedback. At the moment, I feel a bit lost on this subject.
R
RotorMotor23 Sep 2021 16:36@_Ugeen_ you might also want to check whether the controller is connected to the correct drive. I've often heard that this is connected incorrectly.
It would also be interesting to know where the manifold is located. If pipes run through the bedroom, it can get too warm quickly.
It would also be interesting to know where the manifold is located. If pipes run through the bedroom, it can get too warm quickly.
Mahri23 schrieb:
Then set all the ERRs fully open and only the one in the bedroom "almost" completely closed.You almost got it right. It would have been better to reduce the flow instead.
tomtom79 schrieb:
You almost got it right. It would have been better to reduce the flow rate.I can still do that. The cold season is just starting again. 🙂halmi schrieb:
This clearly shows that you shouldn’t rely solely on others but should always actively inform yourself. No one here can really explain what you want to know in a meaningful way. You need to take the initiative first—please try searching for hydraulic or thermal balancing in connection with an air-to-water heat pump.
You can spend 2-3 days reading up on it, then come back here with the information you found and ask specific questions.Without going into too much detail: we actually didn’t plan to build ourselves but wanted to buy a turnkey house. However, circumstances and spontaneous opportunities led us to acquire a plot of land on short notice. Unfortunately, we also had to decide on a home builder quickly. So we didn’t have enough time in some areas to get fully informed. Had we planned this longer, I would have started preparing at least a year ago.netuser schrieb:
That was definitely bad advice, sorry for you! Realistically, you’ll get a 2-4°C (4-7°F) difference. Did you even notice any cooling function?
From what I’ve recently learned, the correct individual room controllers (IRCs) are also important here—they must be compatible with the system....Our IRCs are compatible and were set correctly. However, I didn’t notice any cooling or only very little. With an outdoor temperature of 30°C (86°F), we had indoor temperatures between 24-25°C (75-77°F).Mahri23 schrieb:
We also moved in at the end of January. We have an air-to-water heat pump with underfloor heating and photovoltaic panels.
I experimented for about 14 days until I found the right flow temperature for the air-to-water heat pump. Then I set all IRCs fully open except the one in the bedroom, which I set almost completely closed. This way, the bedroom doesn’t heat up as much and all the other rooms have a consistent, comfortable temperature. The bathrooms also have towel radiators, which only get lukewarm. That’s enough to dry towels overnight or during the day. The electric heating element in my air-to-water heat pump only kicks in at around -15 to -20°C (5 to -4°F), so it didn’t activate last winter.
The combination with the photovoltaic system works great. Since March, I have hardly drawn any electricity from the grid. Even now, my system still fully supplies our house independently.Sounds good. However, I still don’t quite understand the logic with the flow temperature and the IRCs. Since we have digital IRCs, I set them to 19°C (66°F) in the bedroom and guest room. Should I set it even lower? I always understood that the valve opens gradually up to the maximum. From what you’re saying, you either open them fully or shut them almost completely. In our apartment, we didn’t do that but adjusted to the desired temperature using the dial. When the heating was on, a red light would come on.RotorMotor schrieb:
@_Ugeen_ you could also check if the controller is connected to the right actuator. I’ve also often heard of this being wired incorrectly.
It would also be interesting to know where the manifold is located. If pipes run through the bedroom, it can quickly get too warm.Is there any kind of guide on how I can check this myself? I haven’t done anything like this before.tomtom79 schrieb:
You were almost doing it right. You should have reduced the flow rate instead.Sorry to ask again, but where exactly do I do that?Yes, I will do that again. Here is another question. As part of the air-to-water heat pump system, we also received a Lunos system for air exchange and heat recovery. I cannot yet comment on the noticeable benefits of the heat recovery, but regarding the fresh air, the only difference I notice is that it doesn’t smell quite as musty when the windows have been closed for a longer time. If it is cooler outside and I want to let some fresh, cool air into the room, it doesn’t work very effectively through the ventilators. Can you confirm this?
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