ᐅ Cost of a Semi-Detached House in Düsseldorf – Accurate Assessment
Created on: 18 Mar 2015 15:44
1
1stluebbi1
1stluebbi18 Mar 2015 15:44Hello,
I have been reading in this forum for a few days now and am impressed by the expertise here! So I registered because I would like to benefit from your experience.
Our situation is that we are considering buying a plot of land in Düsseldorf together with friends (please no warnings) to build a semi-detached house. We only want to purchase the land if we can afford a house that we like and feel comfortable in. We have a rough budget, but some flexibility upwards within a certain tolerance range is acceptable. The cost for the plot is €200,000 per couple, and we expect additional costs of €50,000 each (an old house must be demolished first). If you tell me now that this is too much, even better.
Ok, we would now like to invest the remaining, let’s say, €250,000 per couple into building a house... The zoning plan states that only one full floor is permitted unless the floor space index (was that the abbreviation?) is no higher than 0.4. In our case, this would mean we could build two full floors with a footprint of approximately 60–65 sqm (65–70 sq ft). There is already a house like this in the neighborhood—which is anyway a mix of different styles. Currently, we favor the following:
- Gable roof, preferably with the option to convert the attic into a guest room (so it only needs to be partially walkable)
- Gable dormer with a flat roof facing the garden
- Energy-efficient house 70 standard (or should it be better?)
- Basement with waterproof concrete tank (due to groundwater...)
- Mostly turnkey
We have obtained an offer from Bien-Zenker (Celebration 131 L), as their show home in Wuppertal appealed greatly to our friends and us. Apart from the fact that the Excel file contained no formulas, so the final price stated was higher than the sum of the individual items, the offer was not too bad. BUT! The prices for certain trades, such as flooring and tile installation as well as sanitary fittings, seem quite high to us. Doing the work ourselves is not an option, but subcontracting to local companies is. Therefore, I have the following questions:
- From your experience, does it make financial sense to separate certain trades (interior doors, painting, floors, tiles, sanitary installations, etc.) and assign them to local craftsmen? I am also worried that once we visit showrooms and reconsider, we might opt for higher quality finishes, meaning going with higher quality local tradespeople upfront could be better.
- What other companies should we request quotes from? We also liked Schwörerhaus and Weberhaus at the exhibition... But maybe there are local companies I don’t know? We have basically decided on a prefab house, but if you have recommendations for solid (masonry) houses, that would not be a bad option either.
- Lastly, a price question: a basement of about 120 sqm (1,290 sq ft) with a waterproof concrete tank for just under €65,000— is that too expensive?
Thank you very much in advance for your help, and if I posted in the wrong subforum, please move this! I thought this thread was the best fit, but I am still not very familiar with the structure here.
Best regards, Katrin
I have been reading in this forum for a few days now and am impressed by the expertise here! So I registered because I would like to benefit from your experience.
Our situation is that we are considering buying a plot of land in Düsseldorf together with friends (please no warnings) to build a semi-detached house. We only want to purchase the land if we can afford a house that we like and feel comfortable in. We have a rough budget, but some flexibility upwards within a certain tolerance range is acceptable. The cost for the plot is €200,000 per couple, and we expect additional costs of €50,000 each (an old house must be demolished first). If you tell me now that this is too much, even better.
Ok, we would now like to invest the remaining, let’s say, €250,000 per couple into building a house... The zoning plan states that only one full floor is permitted unless the floor space index (was that the abbreviation?) is no higher than 0.4. In our case, this would mean we could build two full floors with a footprint of approximately 60–65 sqm (65–70 sq ft). There is already a house like this in the neighborhood—which is anyway a mix of different styles. Currently, we favor the following:
- Gable roof, preferably with the option to convert the attic into a guest room (so it only needs to be partially walkable)
- Gable dormer with a flat roof facing the garden
- Energy-efficient house 70 standard (or should it be better?)
- Basement with waterproof concrete tank (due to groundwater...)
- Mostly turnkey
We have obtained an offer from Bien-Zenker (Celebration 131 L), as their show home in Wuppertal appealed greatly to our friends and us. Apart from the fact that the Excel file contained no formulas, so the final price stated was higher than the sum of the individual items, the offer was not too bad. BUT! The prices for certain trades, such as flooring and tile installation as well as sanitary fittings, seem quite high to us. Doing the work ourselves is not an option, but subcontracting to local companies is. Therefore, I have the following questions:
- From your experience, does it make financial sense to separate certain trades (interior doors, painting, floors, tiles, sanitary installations, etc.) and assign them to local craftsmen? I am also worried that once we visit showrooms and reconsider, we might opt for higher quality finishes, meaning going with higher quality local tradespeople upfront could be better.
- What other companies should we request quotes from? We also liked Schwörerhaus and Weberhaus at the exhibition... But maybe there are local companies I don’t know? We have basically decided on a prefab house, but if you have recommendations for solid (masonry) houses, that would not be a bad option either.
- Lastly, a price question: a basement of about 120 sqm (1,290 sq ft) with a waterproof concrete tank for just under €65,000— is that too expensive?
Thank you very much in advance for your help, and if I posted in the wrong subforum, please move this! I thought this thread was the best fit, but I am still not very familiar with the structure here.
Best regards, Katrin
B
Bauexperte18 Mar 2015 19:44Hello Katrin,
Regards, Bauexperte
1stluebbi schrieb:But not in Haan ... right?
The cost for the plot is 200,000 € per couple
1stluebbi schrieb:Too little, definitely too little. Appropriate would be 35,000 - 40,000 € plus the demolition costs of the existing old building.
and we are calculating 50,000 € per person as additional costs (an old house still needs to be demolished). If you tell me now that this is too much, even better 😀.
1stluebbi schrieb:Floor area ratio equals plot ratio.
Ok, now we would like to invest the remaining, let's say, 250,000 per couple into a house... The development plan only allows one full storey, unless the floor area ratio (was that the abbreviation?)
1stluebbi schrieb:This figure has nothing to do with the number of storeys.
is not higher than 0.4.
1stluebbi schrieb:No. You are allowed to build one storey plus knee wall.
In our case, that would mean that we could build two full storeys with a footprint of about 60-65 sqm (there is already such a house in the settlement – the settlement consists of a mix of random houses anyway...).
1stluebbi schrieb:Should be in the range of about 250,000 € as a solid construction, for a one-storey building.
We are currently favoring the following:
- Gable roof, preferably with the possibility to convert the attic into a guest room (so it only needs to be more or less accessible)
- Cross gable with flat roof towards the garden
- Energy-efficient house 70 (or even better?)
- Basement with waterproof concrete shell (groundwater...)
- semi-finished turnkey
1stluebbi schrieb:No, because their pricing as independent contractors differs from that of affiliated suppliers. In the latter case, the volume of reliable recurring orders makes a difference 😉
- Based on your experience, does it make financial sense to subcontract certain trades (interior doors, painting, flooring & tiles, plumbing fixtures) to local craftspeople?
1stluebbi schrieb:Both options depend on how well you can keep disciplined!
My concern is also that we might end up upgrading again when we visit the showroom, so maybe we’d be better off starting with higher-quality fittings from the local tradespeople from the outset.
1stluebbi schrieb:No.
- Lastly, a price question: a basement under about 120 sqm with a waterproof concrete shell for just under 65,000 € – isn’t that too much???
Regards, Bauexperte
1
1stluebbi18 Mar 2015 20:34Hello, and thanks in advance for your assessments,
No, actually directly in Düsseldorf.
Uh, I was assuming a total of EUR 100,000 (the demolition was calculated at 30,000, for which I have offers. The entire plot costs 400,000 and I am estimating 250,000 for each half buyer. Would that now mean I have overestimated?
The development plan states that exceptions "to the specified number of full floors" are possible in individual cases, "provided the specified general measure of structural use (floor area ratio) is not exceeded." For this reason, and since there is already a modern two-story flat roof building nearby, I came to that conclusion.
That actually doesn’t sound too bad.
Yes, I understand that. I only did a brief internet search to get rough average prices. I deliberately did not choose the cheapest option but rather mid-range materials and looked at installation experiences. When I added that all together, I always ended up with (sometimes much) less than in the offer, which only includes standard materials (e.g., laminate flooring).
Okay, now this thread really doesn’t fit in this subforum anymore, although I would still like recommendations for construction companies. I guess I can’t move the thread myself?
Best regards,
Katrin
Bauexperte schrieb:
But not in Haan ... right?
No, actually directly in Düsseldorf.
Bauexperte schrieb:
Too little, definitely too little. Appropriate would be EUR 35,000 - 40,000 plus costs for the demolition of the existing old property.
Uh, I was assuming a total of EUR 100,000 (the demolition was calculated at 30,000, for which I have offers. The entire plot costs 400,000 and I am estimating 250,000 for each half buyer. Would that now mean I have overestimated?
Bauexperte schrieb:
Floor area ratio = site coverage ratio
This figure has nothing to do with the number of floors.
No. You are allowed to build a single story plus knee wall.
The development plan states that exceptions "to the specified number of full floors" are possible in individual cases, "provided the specified general measure of structural use (floor area ratio) is not exceeded." For this reason, and since there is already a modern two-story flat roof building nearby, I came to that conclusion.
Bauexperte schrieb:
As a single-story solid construction, it would probably cost about EUR 250,000.
That actually doesn’t sound too bad.
Bauexperte schrieb:
No, because their calculation as independent tradespeople looks different than if attached to a provider. In the latter case, volume matters: reliably recurring jobs.
Yes, I understand that. I only did a brief internet search to get rough average prices. I deliberately did not choose the cheapest option but rather mid-range materials and looked at installation experiences. When I added that all together, I always ended up with (sometimes much) less than in the offer, which only includes standard materials (e.g., laminate flooring).
Okay, now this thread really doesn’t fit in this subforum anymore, although I would still like recommendations for construction companies. I guess I can’t move the thread myself?
Best regards,
Katrin
B
Bauexperte18 Mar 2015 20:43Hello Katrin,
It seems so, unless there are surprises hidden in the plot.
You should – even better, an architect or a trusted seller with you – speak to the responsible case officer at the planning department before you commit to something that doesn’t really fit the “in individual cases” wording 😉
Correct assumption.
If you want recommendations for companies, this thread is well placed here. Usually, it’s better if one of the moderators reviews the replies before they are approved 😉 Unless you want to start a new discussion thread for that, in which case I can move this thread to the appropriate forum.
Best regards, Bauexperte
1stluebbi schrieb:
Uh, I was assuming a total of 100,000 EUR (demolition was estimated at 30,000, with offers available. The plot of land costs 400,000, and I’m calculating 250,000 for each half-buyer. Does this mean I’ve actually budgeted too high :p?
It seems so, unless there are surprises hidden in the plot.
1stluebbi schrieb:
The development plan states that exceptions to the fixed number of full stories are allowed in individual cases, “provided that the specified general measure of structural use (floor area ratio) is not exceeded.” Because of this, and since there is already a modern two-story flat-roofed building nearby, I thought of that.
You should – even better, an architect or a trusted seller with you – speak to the responsible case officer at the planning department before you commit to something that doesn’t really fit the “in individual cases” wording 😉
1stluebbi schrieb:
So, this thread really doesn’t fit in this subforum anymore, even though I’d still like recommendations for building companies 😉. I guess I can’t move the thread myself?
Correct assumption.
If you want recommendations for companies, this thread is well placed here. Usually, it’s better if one of the moderators reviews the replies before they are approved 😉 Unless you want to start a new discussion thread for that, in which case I can move this thread to the appropriate forum.
Best regards, Bauexperte
1
1stluebbi18 Mar 2015 20:50Hello,
thank you for your reply!
We are generally leaning toward a pitched roof, as that would still allow for an attic. For a flat roof, it would have to be one with a recessed upper floor above the first floor, and that definitely wouldn’t be feasible (poor neighbors).
Yes, please move the thread, then I will create a new one for recommendations and use this one for further replies about construction/the costs themselves. The title should probably be changed to something like “Costs for Semi-Detached House – Cost Estimate Accuracy” if possible. Thanks!
Best regards,
Katrin
thank you for your reply!
Bauexperte schrieb:
You should – even better, have an architect or a trusted sales representative speak with the responsible official at the planning department before you get fixed on something that might not fit the description “in individual cases.”
We are generally leaning toward a pitched roof, as that would still allow for an attic. For a flat roof, it would have to be one with a recessed upper floor above the first floor, and that definitely wouldn’t be feasible (poor neighbors).
Bauexperte schrieb:
If you want recommendations for companies, this thread works well. Usually, it’s better if one of the moderators reviews the replies before they get approved. Unless you want to start a new discussion thread specifically for that, then I can move this thread to the appropriate forum.
Yes, please move the thread, then I will create a new one for recommendations and use this one for further replies about construction/the costs themselves. The title should probably be changed to something like “Costs for Semi-Detached House – Cost Estimate Accuracy” if possible. Thanks!
Best regards,
Katrin
Whether it makes sense to outsource specific trades such as tiling, sanitary fixtures, and painting cannot be generally stated.
For smaller local companies, I would agree with Bauexperte. For large nationwide companies like the one you mentioned, it can make more sense. With these firms, the cost per square meter of installed tile can easily exceed 120 EUR (I don’t know the exact price from Bien-Zenker, so this is a generalization). These companies usually work only with a few partner firms to ensure consistent quality, which means they operate nationwide and therefore have higher costs that they need to cover. Smaller companies typically work only within their local area and can calculate differently.
You need to evaluate the situation on a case-by-case basis and then decide. Of course, it is more convenient and simpler in terms of warranty to purchase everything from one source. It’s all a question of the total price...
For smaller local companies, I would agree with Bauexperte. For large nationwide companies like the one you mentioned, it can make more sense. With these firms, the cost per square meter of installed tile can easily exceed 120 EUR (I don’t know the exact price from Bien-Zenker, so this is a generalization). These companies usually work only with a few partner firms to ensure consistent quality, which means they operate nationwide and therefore have higher costs that they need to cover. Smaller companies typically work only within their local area and can calculate differently.
You need to evaluate the situation on a case-by-case basis and then decide. Of course, it is more convenient and simpler in terms of warranty to purchase everything from one source. It’s all a question of the total price...
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