Hello,
Last week, we visited the planner for the first time, who is now working on the initial design of our new home. It will be about 140 sqm (1,507 sq ft), one and a half stories, and without a basement. We will be living in it as a family of four. For some time now, I have been thinking about the heating system.
I have spent hours researching online trying to get a clear picture. Here is what I have gathered so far:
Groundwater heat pump -> I initially liked this idea, but since we live near an open-pit mine, I can’t predict how the groundwater in the area might change.
Air source heat pump -> I’m not convinced… low efficiency in cold winters and also disturbing noise.
Ground source heat pump / collector -> One of my favorites, but not possible due to our property.
Ground source heat pump / borehole -> My current favorite. Downside: most expensive to install (unexpected costs with drilling?).
Oil heating -> I rule this out, as it takes up too much space that I’d rather use otherwise.
Pellet heating -> Also ruled out, for the same reason: too much space required.
When I told the planner about my current favorite—the ground source heat pump with a borehole—she introduced the topic of a gas heating system. Heat pumps can cost up to 25,000 euros (about 27,000 USD), and they are no longer as cost-effective... Houses today are insulated so well that gas is not as expensive for a single-family home. Her opinion was that the higher investment in heat pumps would never pay off. Also, the gas connection is already available on our street...
On the other hand, I have read that a gas condensing boiler alone might not be sufficient, as a certain energy standard for new buildings must be met. Therefore, only a gas condensing boiler combined with solar thermal (for hot water) would be feasible and probably sensible. The problem here is the orientation of the house/roof—it does not allow for a south-facing installation of solar collectors. Only east or west-facing options are possible, which are quite ineffective in this context.
What do you think? Do you believe a ground source heat pump would be more cost-effective than a gas condensing boiler? Or does it not make much difference in a new build, and the higher investment is not worth it? Or maybe it is worth it precisely because the solar thermal system cannot be fully utilized?
Estimated costs:
Ground source heat pump with borehole: 25,000 euros (about 27,000 USD)
Gas condensing boiler with solar thermal: 12,000 euros (about 13,000 USD)
New build location near Cottbus (deep eastern region).
Last week, we visited the planner for the first time, who is now working on the initial design of our new home. It will be about 140 sqm (1,507 sq ft), one and a half stories, and without a basement. We will be living in it as a family of four. For some time now, I have been thinking about the heating system.
I have spent hours researching online trying to get a clear picture. Here is what I have gathered so far:
Groundwater heat pump -> I initially liked this idea, but since we live near an open-pit mine, I can’t predict how the groundwater in the area might change.
Air source heat pump -> I’m not convinced… low efficiency in cold winters and also disturbing noise.
Ground source heat pump / collector -> One of my favorites, but not possible due to our property.
Ground source heat pump / borehole -> My current favorite. Downside: most expensive to install (unexpected costs with drilling?).
Oil heating -> I rule this out, as it takes up too much space that I’d rather use otherwise.
Pellet heating -> Also ruled out, for the same reason: too much space required.
When I told the planner about my current favorite—the ground source heat pump with a borehole—she introduced the topic of a gas heating system. Heat pumps can cost up to 25,000 euros (about 27,000 USD), and they are no longer as cost-effective... Houses today are insulated so well that gas is not as expensive for a single-family home. Her opinion was that the higher investment in heat pumps would never pay off. Also, the gas connection is already available on our street...
On the other hand, I have read that a gas condensing boiler alone might not be sufficient, as a certain energy standard for new buildings must be met. Therefore, only a gas condensing boiler combined with solar thermal (for hot water) would be feasible and probably sensible. The problem here is the orientation of the house/roof—it does not allow for a south-facing installation of solar collectors. Only east or west-facing options are possible, which are quite ineffective in this context.
What do you think? Do you believe a ground source heat pump would be more cost-effective than a gas condensing boiler? Or does it not make much difference in a new build, and the higher investment is not worth it? Or maybe it is worth it precisely because the solar thermal system cannot be fully utilized?
Estimated costs:
Ground source heat pump with borehole: 25,000 euros (about 27,000 USD)
Gas condensing boiler with solar thermal: 12,000 euros (about 13,000 USD)
New build location near Cottbus (deep eastern region).
T
toxicmolotof2 Dec 2014 17:52I'm not an expert either, but where did you get that figure from?
Our heat pump costs about 10,000 euros (excluding the materials and the heating system, which are always needed). On top of that, drilling a total of 100 meters (330 feet) costs just over 5,000 euros.
Have you talked to both an installer and a probe driller? Even if you need more capacity than we do, there’s still quite a bit of room for negotiation.
Ground source heat pump with ground probe: 25,000 euros
Our heat pump costs about 10,000 euros (excluding the materials and the heating system, which are always needed). On top of that, drilling a total of 100 meters (330 feet) costs just over 5,000 euros.
Have you talked to both an installer and a probe driller? Even if you need more capacity than we do, there’s still quite a bit of room for negotiation.
Our costs for the gas connection and gas condensing boiler as an example:
2500 EUR for Viessmann Vitodens 200-W
700 EUR for Viessmann Vitocell 100-W
380 EUR for installation materials
(all net prices)
The individual requirements for piping and radiators/underfloor heating in the house are additional, but that is not the point here.
1785 EUR gross for the gas connection
In total, approximately 6050 EUR gross
2500 EUR for Viessmann Vitodens 200-W
700 EUR for Viessmann Vitocell 100-W
380 EUR for installation materials
(all net prices)
The individual requirements for piping and radiators/underfloor heating in the house are additional, but that is not the point here.
1785 EUR gross for the gas connection
In total, approximately 6050 EUR gross
toxicmolotow schrieb:
I'm not an expert either, but where did you get this figure from?
Our heat pump costs about 10,000 euros (excluding materials and the heating system, which are always needed). Additionally, drilling a total of 100 m (330 ft) costs just over 5,000 euros.
Have you spoken with both an installer and a probe driller? Even if you need more capacity than we do, there is still quite some room for adjustment.As I said, these values are based on my online research so far. I often found around 20,000 euros. I calculated a bit higher... better to overestimate than underestimate. Also, because I have read in other forums about ground-source heat pumps with earth probes costing 40,000 euros...
klblb schrieb:
Our example costs for gas connection and gas condensing boiler:
2,500 EUR for Viessmann Vitodens 200-W
700 EUR for Viessmann Vitocell 100-W
380 EUR for installation supplies
(all net prices)
The individual requirements for piping and radiators/floor heating in the house are additional, but that’s not the main point here
1,785 EUR gross for the gas connection
In total around 6,050 EUR grossThanks for sharing these numbers...
For us, a solar thermal system would also be added here... then it would probably be around 9,000 to 10,000 euros.
By the way, the new building is supposed to be fully equipped with underfloor heating. Would a low-temperature gas boiler be of any benefit in this case?
A trench collector could work for you, provided that you are allowed to lay the pipes at least straight over the water pipe. It might also be enough to stay on one side, but this will probably be tight in terms of heat extraction capacity.
Search online; this topic is extensively discussed on the internet, and doing it yourself can be more cost-effective than a ground collector.
The difference compared to a gas condensing boiler is likely not very significant.
Search online; this topic is extensively discussed on the internet, and doing it yourself can be more cost-effective than a ground collector.
The difference compared to a gas condensing boiler is likely not very significant.
oleda222 schrieb:
A trench collector could work for you, provided you are allowed to lay the pipes at least straight above the water pipe. It might also be sufficient to stay on one side, but then the heat extraction capacity will probably be limited.
Search online—this topic is widely discussed on the internet and, with DIY work, it can be cheaper than a surface collector.
The difference compared to a gas condensing boiler should not be very large.What sizing do the collectors need to have? I once read about a size twice the heated area... 140 m² (1507 sq ft) x 2 = 280 m² (3014 sq ft) collector area? On one side, maybe 140 m² (1507 sq ft) is possible considering boundary distances... I actually didn’t want to go over the water pipe itself, as it is roughly at 2.00 meters (6.6 feet) depth.
B
Bauexperte3 Dec 2014 11:01Hello,
Where do you get this information from? Heat pumps have not been in use long enough to provide reliable data regarding their lifespan.
Is it an air-to-air heat pump or an air-to-water heat pump? What is the storage volume of the domestic hot water tank?
Regards, Bauexperte
Bauabenteurer schrieb:
What is often overlooked is that the air source heat pump has a similar service life as a gas heater. That means it needs to be replaced after about 15 years at the latest.
Where do you get this information from? Heat pumps have not been in use long enough to provide reliable data regarding their lifespan.
Bauabenteurer schrieb:
Also, friends of ours reported that the air source heat pump sometimes struggles to provide enough hot water for a household of four people (for example, when everyone showers one after another after a day out).
Is it an air-to-air heat pump or an air-to-water heat pump? What is the storage volume of the domestic hot water tank?
Regards, Bauexperte
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