chand1986 schrieb:
Did you wear everything only once before washing it?
Sounds like you’re starting to do what others have always done.
I hope you realize how cringe-worthy that sentence is.
But good that it’s working now.
I also wear clothes once and then wash them…
.. and this must also be taken into account in the overall assessment. Producing diesel/gasoline requires energy, which is saved as more people switch to BEVs. Diesel/gasoline also have to be transported by road to reach the end user, which in turn adds wear and tear to the roads. So, you cannot simply calculate ... more BEVs .. higher electricity consumption, but must also offset the saved expenses.
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wiltshire17 Jun 2025 23:52kbt09 schrieb:
.. and this must also be considered in the overall assessment. Producing diesel/gasoline requires energy, Exactly. Depending on the source you consult, you get very different figures. If you average between oil companies and environmental organizations, it comes to about 3 kWh per liter of diesel. That is almost one-third of the energy content of diesel. The amount of CO2 and pollution emissions associated with these 3 kWh is unclear, but the share from oil-producing countries and offshore extraction is likely extremely polluting.
Some people understand that electricity doesn’t just come from the socket, but somehow still believe that diesel just comes from the pump.
Now, there just need to be affordable and suitable BEVs available. But car prices in general have increased so much.
Four years ago, we bought a used Astra with the smallest engine as a second car for under 15,000€ (about 15,000 USD). Buying the same car again now with the same mileage would cost nearly the same price. If you sell it, the only difference would be the dealership’s margin.
Even though I would like to switch the vehicle to a BEV, it is extremely difficult to find economic benefits with a BEV, even with a photovoltaic system.
Four years ago, we bought a used Astra with the smallest engine as a second car for under 15,000€ (about 15,000 USD). Buying the same car again now with the same mileage would cost nearly the same price. If you sell it, the only difference would be the dealership’s margin.
Even though I would like to switch the vehicle to a BEV, it is extremely difficult to find economic benefits with a BEV, even with a photovoltaic system.
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wiltshire18 Jun 2025 11:51Musketier schrieb:
Even though I would like to switch the vehicle to a BEV, it is extremely difficult to find economic advantages with a BEV, even when combined with a photovoltaic system. Your Astra will still be good for several years, and the resources already invested in manufacturing the vehicle should not be wasted. It is sufficient for new purchases to increasingly be BEVs. This will gradually change the overall fleet bit by bit. Considering that with today’s vehicle prices, the new buyers are usually leasing companies or businesses, this is acceptable. Just look at the development with some patience over time. BEVs are already becoming significantly cheaper, and here and there you can find excellent leasing or rental deals. You are in no rush and (hopefully) not under social pressure either.
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nordanney18 Jun 2025 11:59Musketier schrieb:
Four years ago, we bought an Astra with the smallest engine as a nearly new car for under 15,000 euros. A BEV can't really compete with that. But for new cars at least starting from the "Golf size" segment, the prices are actually quite close when you consider the equipment, as long as you don’t choose a combustion engine car without any extra features and with the smallest engine.
Fortunately, smaller cars that are affordable are now slowly coming to the market (the e208 is quite cute). Inside, there’s also plenty of space, typical for BEVs.
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MachsSelbst18 Jun 2025 13:44That’s one way to look at it. But where would humanity be today if we had stuck to what we already had for the sake of conserving resources?
What if people had been satisfied with the Golf IV, for example? Or with Windows XP? Or the first generation of smartphones? What if people in the Middle Ages had been content? Or even cavemen?
That’s not how progress works. We live the way we do today because those before us were not satisfied with what they had...
So the real question isn’t whether an internal combustion engine (ICE) or a battery electric vehicle (BEV) is better in terms of CO2 emissions.
In a world fully powered by renewable energy, BEVs are unavoidable because most things rely on electricity.
It just doesn’t make sense to produce gasoline from electricity with high losses, only to burn it in an engine that is about 30% efficient.
The only exception I see:
Natural gas or methane for heating, whether in buildings or industry.
It can be used with nearly 100% efficiency and can be stored in huge quantities very simply.
And of course, aviation – it won’t work without kerosene.
Militarily, everything will move toward fully autonomous drones sooner or later; tanks and artillery will become things of the past.
What if people had been satisfied with the Golf IV, for example? Or with Windows XP? Or the first generation of smartphones? What if people in the Middle Ages had been content? Or even cavemen?
That’s not how progress works. We live the way we do today because those before us were not satisfied with what they had...
So the real question isn’t whether an internal combustion engine (ICE) or a battery electric vehicle (BEV) is better in terms of CO2 emissions.
In a world fully powered by renewable energy, BEVs are unavoidable because most things rely on electricity.
It just doesn’t make sense to produce gasoline from electricity with high losses, only to burn it in an engine that is about 30% efficient.
The only exception I see:
Natural gas or methane for heating, whether in buildings or industry.
It can be used with nearly 100% efficiency and can be stored in huge quantities very simply.
And of course, aviation – it won’t work without kerosene.
Militarily, everything will move toward fully autonomous drones sooner or later; tanks and artillery will become things of the past.