ᐅ Estimated Construction Costs for a Single-Family Home in the Tübingen Area

MachsSelbst schrieb:

What would have been your leverage if someone had not kept their commitment?

Emergencies can happen to anyone, no less to yourself than to a friend. In my experience, a commitment is a commitment—both ways. A reliable person only makes a promise after considering potential uncertainties. Otherwise, it’s not a real commitment, just empty talk.
You seem to want to generalize and claim that there are no reliable agreements with friends or others, or that there is only one truly reliable person besides all the beer-drinking kebab eaters—and of course, that person is yourself. Who else?

MachsSelbst schrieb:

The safest bet is to assume you’ll end up doing the work alone.

As the saying goes, "I’ll send my best guy, but I’m coming myself." I’m not denying that you can or should do the work on your own. But as a general statement that this is always the best way, I can’t confirm that.

MachsSelbst schrieb:

I had to sort out the rest because it required too much explanation and/or people were just rushing through it, as long as there’s beer and a kebab after the work.

I don’t disagree with your personal experience, though I do notice your use of the word "sort out" regarding friends. But it remains your individual experience.

MachsSelbst schrieb:

Maybe we live in different worlds; that wouldn’t be wrong.

Not worlds, but certainly very different environments—which, by the way, we create ourselves and are responsible for.

MachsSelbst schrieb:

In my world, two mates moved abroad for work in the past two years, so they couldn’t have fulfilled the "BroCode" even if they wanted to.

I don’t know "BroCode," except sometimes from movies about rappers who mostly don’t build houses.
There are always go-to arguments that don’t add value to a serious discussion. For example, my son was just on the 30th floor when the earthquake happened in Thailand; I had a medical emergency years ago; an acquaintance had an accident. That’s life for everyone—sooner or later. But should we avoid building because of that? Did I or any of them have, for each emergency you mentioned, an emergency backup plan ready? Certainly not.

MachsSelbst schrieb:

Who is truly reliable and who isn’t isn’t revealed in intense conversations... it only shows in reality on-site, when you’re expected to help your friend four weekends in a row and your wife complains about when you’ll finally spend time with the kids again.

Apparently yes, for you. In my life, a friend discusses such things with his wife in advance and assesses his ability and willingness before giving a firm commitment. Then it’s not about "constantly complaining wives" but about your own responsibility to create a reliable environment. We clearly have different views of friendship—and seemingly your negative generalizations about beer-drinking kebab lovers and, now, "complaining wives" seem outdated.

MachsSelbst schrieb:

Just because it worked for you, you can’t seriously recommend it as a rule for everyone else.

My advice is the opposite of a generalization; it’s specifically about clarifying what kind and how much help you can expect. You should reread before reacting after the second word.

MachsSelbst schrieb:

How naive or forgetful is that?

Says who?
Know-it-alls often end up alone in life or feel abandoned—and naturally, it’s always others’ fault or they are just stupid.

MachsSelbst schrieb:

Be glad it worked out for you; in 95% of cases it’s different.

Your next generalization also misses the mark. It’s funny that you accuse me of generalizing while you spread them here in a downpour.
In my several building projects, there were always problems, sometimes serious ones. But they were not caused by unreliable friends, often by myself; though who admits that willingly when you can blame others.
Your claim that in 95% of cases you can’t rely on agreements with friends needs no further comment and only shows the uniqueness of your life or environment. Let’s end this rather sad interpersonal digression here; this is about important matters for the original poster.

@D-Zug88 Based on what I’ve read from you so far, I assume you understand my point—and that’s the main thing.
You should know the specific extent to which your friends can and want to help you with your project. Anything between 0 and 100% is possible, even if not everyone here is familiar with that. Be clear about what your painter friend will do and how, as well as the tiler. If it turns out to be nothing or just a little, that’s important knowledge too.
If you can actually exclude certain trades entirely (e.g. painter, tiler), then a company like Town & Country will probably be off the table, as the credits they offer may be too low. Then you will need a different type of provider. Our general contractor let us exclude and contract out certain trades, but we received full credit for them. For example, we excluded the wooden staircase, facade, flooring including wood frame construction and insulation (except bathroom), window sills, and so on.

Phew, the kebab-side comments from the stands have overused a simple but important point: verifying the kind of skilled help you can expect from friends and planning your next steps accordingly.

I can understand MachsSelbst’s point. Every friend will probably help voluntarily for a day or two. Beyond that, it becomes clear who is genuinely helpful and who might expect the same favor in return during their own house construction. So, if you have several people supporting you diligently over weeks, you can reasonably expect to spend many weekends helping out on other construction sites in return.

Musketier schrieb:

I can understand MachsSelbst’s point. Everyone will probably volunteer to help for one or two days. Beyond that, it separates the wheat from the chaff, or the friend expects a similar favor when building their own house. So if you have dedicated helpers from several people over weeks, you can definitely expect to spend many weekends helping out on other construction sites later on.

And what stops you from clarifying this in advance, so you can plan accordingly in your build?
Friends don’t have to help with house construction; who says they must or even assumes it? I don’t.
A thoughtful reader can see here that it’s also perfectly okay if a friend offers no help at all. But if there is talk of help—as there is here—I don’t see why this shouldn’t be confirmed beforehand instead of relying on wishful thinking.
At this stage in my life, I can or want to no longer do hard work on other people’s construction sites, and I say so openly as well. Do I expect the opposite? No, how could I?

Musketier schrieb:

You can definitely expect to spend many weekends helping out on other construction sites later on.

Assuming something instead of clarifying it is exactly the root cause of frustration—holding expectations without any basis instead of discussing them firmly, and if the answer is no, then it’s no.
I once completed a project without any outside help. That was fine too, because no one has to help me to be my friend, nor is it a mandatory part of my friendships.
My uncle really did everything for us related to woodwork in our two-family house, except the roof; he promised us he would do that himself, and that’s how he wanted it.
Had I doubted that, it would have offended him. I recently installed the kitchen for my son on schedule. Had he doubted my reliability, it would have hurt me. A young friend still helps us repeatedly with difficult things in the house, and within our agreements, I can rely on him.
Unfortunately, discussions like this increasingly tend to become extreme or are deliberately misquoted nowadays, leading to the idea that only I am the only right and reliable person. But you should always first look in your own mirror if something goes wrong, because most of the time you bear a significant part of responsibility for a failure; admitting that is often harder than blaming others.

Musketier schrieb:

the friend then expects the same favor during their own house build.

A completely understandable perspective—but one that should still be openly discussed beforehand and not skirted around with hopes and assumptions. Is it really so difficult to talk openly and then possibly accept a "no" from the so-called “bro”? Sorry, not my thing.
Again, @Musketier Nobody says how much or whether friends should help. But if this is even a possibility, it should be reliably clarified first. That’s how I handle all other areas of life too, with my wife (who, in some people’s eyes, complains constantly—not in my case). I rely on people in my private circle after we make an agreement. And if it never works out, or I even feel betrayed like here (keyword lazy friends), then I need to recognize my part in that and change accordingly, instead of doubting the value of friendships or agreements in general.

Arauki11 schrieb:

A commitment is a commitment in my life.

Distinguish between buddy and friend, and that makes all the difference.
In the end, this was about buddies, not friends.

ypg schrieb:

Distinguish between buddy and friend, and then it makes sense.
Ultimately, this was about buddies, not friends.

I don’t think there is a universally strict definition for that. For me, a commitment is something I consciously make or choose not to make, fully aware of its consequences. That applies equally to my friend, buddy, neighbor, and mail carrier—but of course, everyone can handle that as they prefer.
Based on (age-related) experience, I also advise the original poster (OP) to address things clearly in advance. Still, I often see, especially among younger generations, that people sometimes don’t take what they’ve said as seriously anymore and, above all, tend to avoid truly open conversations.
That’s probably how seemingly ultra-casual terms like “bro” (brother) or other exaggerations come up everywhere.
The OP will know how to interpret this advice and the comments for their own situation—that’s what matters most.

MachsSelbst schrieb:

Your theory fails at the very first paragraph when faced with reality.

Are you referring to binding commitments from family, friends, neighbors, and acquaintances?
Apparently, we come from very different environments.

MachsSelbst schrieb:

What would have been your leverage if someone had failed to keep their commitment?

The idea of having "leverage" to force someone to help me after they’ve promised it feels foreign to me. My experience is that if one person is unavailable, someone else steps in. Others can rely on me as well, and when help is urgently needed, I adjust my plans to assist.
As I said, we live in different environments.
The "trick" is quite simple. Those who shape and contribute to their communities meet people with a similar attitude, and mutual reliability works. It’s not even necessary to particularly like each other or be friends. It’s simply the age-old concept of collective strength, where everyone benefits.