ᐅ Video doorbell system with two-wire setup, new construction

The classic scenario: electricians who lack motivation and/or expertise, and homeowners who simply have no knowledge. Is it no longer possible to install wiring now? Or is it? I don’t have the current construction progress on hand. In the meantime, you might want to start researching “Wi-Fi mesh” systems, I think. Please don’t even consider Devolo or other powerline adapters.

hanse987 schrieb:

I have a bad feeling, but hope dies last.
You do know exactly what was agreed with the electrician, or did you really just say “one network connection please”?

I rather suspect the order was more like "one as usual." If the electrician doesn’t look close to retirement yet, unfortunately many builders assume they know what decade we are currently in.

JayneCobb schrieb:

So nothing else stood out during the walkthrough.

Such on-site meetings only make sense if you follow a script; otherwise, it’s like playing a spinning wheel blindfolded.

JayneCobb schrieb:

Guess: Maybe it’s not just about quality, but also that Wi-Fi might fail more often than LAN?

Araknis schrieb:

If there’s decent Wi-Fi, it can work well. But there’s a reason for the saying “those who know wireless choose cable.”

I couldn’t have put it better. A cable simply provides the “shortest” and most stable connection to a fixed endpoint: direct, continuous, without repeaters. The risk of failure is essentially the same for both, since they are often managed by the same triple-play all-in-one box.

JayneCobb schrieb:

I still don’t fully understand what the architect was supposed to do here or how this relates to their professional liability insurance? Would they actually have been the main contact for this? And “opening up” sounds more like a drastic measure...
I’ll first try to get details about the empty conduits from the electrician.

Yes, that assumes knowledge of my way of thinking, where a house planned with an architect covers contract phases 1 through 8, meaning the architect also does detailed planning, tendering, and site supervision. Ideally, this should provide multiple safeguards against an electrician wire-pulling a doorbell cable “behind the plaster” as if it were still the Schmidt era. “Opening up” was just a casual phrase; using a wall chase cutter makes it quick and relatively painless (the undersized cable may get damaged in the process, but it won’t be reused anyway).

JayneCobb schrieb:

We obviously hadn’t thought about the fact that somewhat more area inside the house needs coverage (which is what the access points are for, right?).

(Wi-Fi) Access points provide wireless network coverage. Mark all users on the floor plans, separating stationary from mobile devices. For example, you use a laptop to access the internet in the living/dining room, sometimes moving into the study. You wouldn’t reconnect it there for just half an hour, but you would for a whole day of working from home. You rarely surf at the dining table, but often on the sofa. So as just one user on the plan, you would be represented by several symbols: sitting as "x" and roaming as "!". Specifically in this example: "!" at the dining table, "!!" on the sofa, "!" in every hallway from living to study, and in the study then "!" and "xx" (you), plus another "x" (scanner/printer/fax). Now you can see where network sockets and access points need to go (latter preferably on the ceiling).

Back to solving the original question: it is definitely possible to handle a classic doorbell intercom via wired connections, with the video function separate and independent (possibly also on different cable or wireless routes). The issue is complex: architects delegate planning to electricians, and electricians rely on manufacturers to think for them. Unfortunately, manufacturers usually have ONE philosophy (and they stick to it stubbornly; innovation is seen as something for dreamers and other softies). Due to what I’d call “long-standing reasons,” some manufacturers pride themselves on using as few wires as possible. But there are also others (with the same rigid adherence to their philosophy — Catholic or Protestant, ecumenism is devil’s work to both sides). A competent planner always installs network cables*, since these are fully backward-compatible; in other words, the cable doesn’t mind if three pairs of wires remain unused. The electrician is often loyal to his brand until death: if he swears by Grothe, he won’t care whether Siedle would work better. So I would definitely consider letting the electrician “plan” the doorbell intercom in his way, and separately operate a set of, for example, two webcams via smartphone, whose motion detectors can also call you if someone lingers in front of the door. These could very well be people who don’t even intend to ring the bell.

When it comes to (W)LAN, every electrician who passed his master craftsman exam after the Euro change feels “modern enough.” How up-to-date he really is depends on how often he checks his apprentices’ vocational school notebooks (and if he dares to ask what’s in them). The average village electrician calls every Western plug “digital.” He’s never needed to know more, and that’s been the case since grandfather’s time. He leases his Toyota HiAce from Ismairwilfried (I assume Gerhard Polt’s Sportpalast speech is well known) and that’s it — good enough until retirement.

*) dear readers still “ante up”: one run of 10 conductor cable (10DA) or two runs of 4 conductor cable (4DA) between door and the opener is never too much

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Are you absolutely sure you need something like that? Because to me, it doesn’t sound necessary. For a typical single-family home, a simple intercom system on the upper floor is usually enough in case it takes a bit longer to get to the door.

Companies like DHL, Amazon, etc., now simply leave packages at the door or in a designated spot. In the past, you had to speak with the delivery person to prevent them from taking the package back. Nowadays, that’s generally not needed at all.

And who else really needs video capability? Maybe just for guests you don’t want to let in. If you’re not expecting many uninvited visitors and can’t run additional cables, I wouldn’t make a big deal out of it.

Yes, Wi-Fi is definitely sufficient. However, you’ll need a power source somewhere if you don’t want to regularly change batteries. Therefore, a network cable that can also transmit power via PoE (requires a compatible switch) would be beneficial.

FloHB123 schrieb:

If we are talking about a typical single-family house, then simply an intercom system on the upper floor is usually sufficient, in case it takes a bit longer to get to the door.

We are referring to a "typical single-family house," even if the layout is reversed (with the upper floor at the bottom), yes.

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FloHB123 schrieb:

If you’re not expecting many unwanted visitors and can’t run any other cables, I wouldn’t make a big deal out of it.

I do see advantages, especially if you have children, as it prevents just anyone unfamiliar from being let in immediately. When we were kids, we had a door chain and later a door viewer. Since then, I haven’t seen a chain like that again.
If you want to control it via an app, this means the system must be accessible from outside. Whether you really want that—especially if door unlocking is involved—is something everyone has to decide for themselves. Comfort versus security.

Our electrician was just as clueless, and we didn’t consider this at all during the initial planning.
So, we only had a single bell wire and had to retrofit a network cable for the intercom, plus one cable for the door opener and an automatic lock last year. I wanted to combine a camera with door unlocking using fingerprint and chip systems, but you quickly hit limits with affordable providers. If you add insurance-compliant locking and emergency opening functions, for example, in case of power failure, the options become even more limited. You really need to think carefully in advance about what cables are needed and where. For instance, I couldn’t reach the outdoor station with just one LAN cable—I also needed a separate cable for door control.

If door unlocking is important, then it also matters whether there is a cable supplying signal and power to the door.

Musketier schrieb:

Our electrician was just as incompetent, and we didn’t consider this at all during the selection phase.
That’s why we only had one doorbell wire and had to retrofit a network cable for the intercom, plus a cable for the door opener and an automatic lock last year. I wanted to combine a camera with door opening by fingerprint and chip system, but with the cheaper providers you quickly reach limits. If you then also add insurance-compliant locking and emergency opening functions, for example in case of a power failure, the options become even more limited. You really have to think carefully in advance about what cables you need and where. For example, I couldn’t get a LAN cable to the outdoor station and needed an additional cable for door control.

I’m currently in the same situation, running cables to the door in the shell stage, but I’m not yet sure how to implement it.
We’re getting a front door with an automatic lock and a numeric code keypad, which means it requires at least a 4-core bell/telephone cable to the bell transformer in the meter cabinet.

Additionally, I want an outdoor station with a doorbell button and camera, which I could connect via PoE.
Now, I’m unsure about the best way to run the network connection through the 36.5cm (14 inch) aerated concrete wall with plaster:
1. Drill through, push through the CAT installation cable, and leave it hanging out?
2. Drill through, push through the CAT installation cable, and lead it outside into a surface-mounted box? (Problem: Outdoor stations are usually flush-mounted, so a surface-mounted box would interfere.)
3. Drill through, push a conduit through, install a flush-mounted box inside, run the CAT installation cable up to the flush-mounted box, then connect the outdoor station to the box via patch cable through the conduit?

Of course, everything must be properly airtight and secure.