Hello dear community,
we are just beginning to explore the topic of Smart Home and I would appreciate your opinions on our current (early) planning.
Starting point:
- New build of a single-family house with a general contractor, approximately 160m² (1720 sq ft) of living space, 3 children’s bedrooms + home office
- Building permit / planning permission currently pending; construction start planned for spring
- I would like to create and customize the Smart Home logic myself; I am willing to study it in depth and enjoy the topic
Planned automation:
(1) Starting with very simple functions such as automatic lights on/off with presence detection for 6 rooms (WC, utility room, storage room, upstairs and downstairs hallway, staircase)
(2) In the guest bathroom, music should also turn on with presence detection and possibly increase ventilation slightly
(3) Throughout the entire upper floor (6 rooms), a night light should turn on at night when movement is detected (e.g., for nighttime bathroom visits)
(4) All blinds / shutters (16x) should be controllable individually (based on time or sun position)
(5) All windows/doors (17x) equipped with tilt sensors to detect open windows, e.g., warnings in case of rain, alerts when the house is left, simple alarm system
(6) Front door with electric lock and video doorbell
(7) Underfloor heating digitally controllable per room
(8) Simple outdoor automations for lighting (motion sensors) and cameras
(9) We want to avoid push buttons wherever possible; we prefer voice control or even better fully automated operation without any interaction
Still open / to discuss:
(1) Hot water and circulation only at certain times or when someone is at home (is this financially worthwhile with efficient heat pumps at all?)
(2) CO2 sensors, for example in the home office, to control ventilation based on presence/absence (e.g., ventilation set to maximum if I quickly leave for coffee and the CO2 value exceeds a certain threshold)
(3) Networked smoke detectors as an alarm system and to hear a fire alarm from the ground floor in the bedroom (?)
(4) Robot vacuum cleaner in the hallway that starts automatically when entering or leaving the house (to clean dirt in the hallway)
(5) Lawn mower that only operates under certain weather conditions and when no one is in the garden
(6) Automatic garden irrigation depending on the forecasted weather (cistern planned)
(7) Towel heater in the bathroom to switch on/off selectively (e.g., warm bathroom in the morning, warm towels right after showering)
(8) "Public address" system from the kitchen to all children’s bedrooms (“Dinner is ready”)
Questions:
(1) Do the planned automations make sense so far?
(2) Do you have any comments and/or recommendations regarding the open points? Are there any interesting automations we are missing?
(3) What is the best way to plan such a Smart Home with a general contractor? They only offer a lump sum package through their electrician with a “Smart@Home” system. I would prefer to plan with a specialized electrician. Is it possible to exclude this trade from the contract and award it separately, or would this cause problems?
(4) Am I correct in assuming that a KNX wired system would be suitable for the above use cases? As a comparison, I roughly calculated Homematic IP flush-mounted installation costs between 5,000–10,000€ as an additional investment (besides the standard general contractor electrical work). How could I make a reasonable cost estimate for KNX? Background: If a wireless solution costs me 10,000€, I want to carefully consider whether I am willing to spend 30,000€+ on KNX.
(5) Is it realistically possible in such a Smart Home to almost completely do without push buttons in the rooms? (We find voice control much more convenient and currently use a lot of Alexa)
we are just beginning to explore the topic of Smart Home and I would appreciate your opinions on our current (early) planning.
Starting point:
- New build of a single-family house with a general contractor, approximately 160m² (1720 sq ft) of living space, 3 children’s bedrooms + home office
- Building permit / planning permission currently pending; construction start planned for spring
- I would like to create and customize the Smart Home logic myself; I am willing to study it in depth and enjoy the topic
Planned automation:
(1) Starting with very simple functions such as automatic lights on/off with presence detection for 6 rooms (WC, utility room, storage room, upstairs and downstairs hallway, staircase)
(2) In the guest bathroom, music should also turn on with presence detection and possibly increase ventilation slightly
(3) Throughout the entire upper floor (6 rooms), a night light should turn on at night when movement is detected (e.g., for nighttime bathroom visits)
(4) All blinds / shutters (16x) should be controllable individually (based on time or sun position)
(5) All windows/doors (17x) equipped with tilt sensors to detect open windows, e.g., warnings in case of rain, alerts when the house is left, simple alarm system
(6) Front door with electric lock and video doorbell
(7) Underfloor heating digitally controllable per room
(8) Simple outdoor automations for lighting (motion sensors) and cameras
(9) We want to avoid push buttons wherever possible; we prefer voice control or even better fully automated operation without any interaction
Still open / to discuss:
(1) Hot water and circulation only at certain times or when someone is at home (is this financially worthwhile with efficient heat pumps at all?)
(2) CO2 sensors, for example in the home office, to control ventilation based on presence/absence (e.g., ventilation set to maximum if I quickly leave for coffee and the CO2 value exceeds a certain threshold)
(3) Networked smoke detectors as an alarm system and to hear a fire alarm from the ground floor in the bedroom (?)
(4) Robot vacuum cleaner in the hallway that starts automatically when entering or leaving the house (to clean dirt in the hallway)
(5) Lawn mower that only operates under certain weather conditions and when no one is in the garden
(6) Automatic garden irrigation depending on the forecasted weather (cistern planned)
(7) Towel heater in the bathroom to switch on/off selectively (e.g., warm bathroom in the morning, warm towels right after showering)
(8) "Public address" system from the kitchen to all children’s bedrooms (“Dinner is ready”)
Questions:
(1) Do the planned automations make sense so far?
(2) Do you have any comments and/or recommendations regarding the open points? Are there any interesting automations we are missing?
(3) What is the best way to plan such a Smart Home with a general contractor? They only offer a lump sum package through their electrician with a “Smart@Home” system. I would prefer to plan with a specialized electrician. Is it possible to exclude this trade from the contract and award it separately, or would this cause problems?
(4) Am I correct in assuming that a KNX wired system would be suitable for the above use cases? As a comparison, I roughly calculated Homematic IP flush-mounted installation costs between 5,000–10,000€ as an additional investment (besides the standard general contractor electrical work). How could I make a reasonable cost estimate for KNX? Background: If a wireless solution costs me 10,000€, I want to carefully consider whether I am willing to spend 30,000€+ on KNX.
(5) Is it realistically possible in such a Smart Home to almost completely do without push buttons in the rooms? (We find voice control much more convenient and currently use a lot of Alexa)
R
RotorMotor5 Jan 2024 21:33For measuring a TV, I can only recommend measuring the real power consumption.
I tried measuring the current, and that was not very reliable.
I’m almost considering redesigning it.
In my case, I noticed that costs were accepted rather carelessly during planning.
Now, afterwards, people look more carefully at whether it’s worth spending another 300€ for an actuator.
Such amounts can no longer be easily overlooked.
Maybe you can “monitor” the TV via the power outlet, but you could also skip that and simply query it directly through an API?!
I tried measuring the current, and that was not very reliable.
I’m almost considering redesigning it.
In my case, I noticed that costs were accepted rather carelessly during planning.
Now, afterwards, people look more carefully at whether it’s worth spending another 300€ for an actuator.
Such amounts can no longer be easily overlooked.
Maybe you can “monitor” the TV via the power outlet, but you could also skip that and simply query it directly through an API?!
Schnubbihh schrieb:
Forgotten shoes in the hallway have long stopped being an obstacle for my robot vacuum. It reliably recognizes them and drives around. Shoes themselves are not a problem, but shoelaces get sucked in. So if you’re not disciplined and don’t always keep everything out of the vacuum’s reach, the automation won’t work.
hausbau_phobos schrieb:
You follow the latest standards in all other things, but when it comes to the electrical system, you’re planning with 1950’s technology?
To me, it’s like controlled mechanical ventilation – sure, I could ventilate myself.
But I don’t have to anymore. That comparison is way off. KNX has nothing to do with the current electrical standards. The current standard is more about complying with the latest regulations, installing more power outlets than before, and possibly preparing the wiring for an electric vehicle charging station (wallbox).
Araknis schrieb:
To keep the comparison going: Then I simply won’t buy a car from a company that can’t even offer a high-beam assistant. And if the car is rusty everywhere because I didn’t check properly when buying, it surely isn’t the high-beam assistant’s fault. It’s really funny how KNX advocates feel attacked when someone disagrees with their opinion.
I’m not fundamentally against it, but I don’t understand this forced attempt to automate things where cost and benefit are completely unbalanced. I can accept lighting control. Temperature sensors to monitor the fridge and freezer also make sense. Heating control in new builds is mostly a gimmick. If heating costs are already low, it makes no sense to invest three- or four-figure sums just to “save” a few euros.
How is it supposed to work to turn on the towel radiator early enough when showering so the towel is actually warm? That only works with time-based switching. Presence detection doesn’t make sense because you visit the bathroom more than once a day. If multiple people need to shower in the morning, no one can stand in the shower for 15 minutes waiting for the towel to warm up.
Lowering external blinds (or shutters) when the TV is on? That only makes sense if you are really bothered by glare. You would need to consider not only time and general weather but also the exact sun position including cloud cover. Otherwise, you sit in the dark as soon as the TV is switched on. Fantastic 🙄
Much better to use a sun sensor that controls the blinds in general to prevent overheating.
For many of the functions listed, there are either simpler solutions from individual manufacturers or they can be implemented with manageable effort without wiring the entire house.
In this forum, you often read that people are planning with KNX and all the amazing things it can do.
However, I have yet to read about what was actually implemented and works in practice. A real user report would really interest me.
There are simply people who have no interest in this and no creativity to come up with scenarios for it. They just don’t need it. Then there are others who enjoy it and appreciate the increase in comfort. Just because you don’t know any good smart home projects doesn’t mean anything. It’s not your area of expertise – absolutely fine. But please don’t try to take the fun away from others by claiming that a collection of isolated systems can produce just as good a result. I’m not only a fanboy in this area, but I also work on the contractor side. So I’m definitely not neutral on the subject, but I do know quite a few projects that are a lot of fun.
Perfect example. Just because you have no idea how to do something like this, it doesn’t work in your world. Horizon with a radius of zero – that’s your position.
No offense, but if you have absolutely nothing constructive to contribute, it’s better to simply stay out of a thread for those who are interested.
FloHB123 schrieb:
How is it supposed to work to switch the towel radiator on early enough while showering so that the towel is really warm? That only works with time-based switching. Presence detection doesn’t make sense, since you visit the bathroom more than once a day. If multiple people need to shower in the morning, you can’t just stand in the shower for 15 minutes until the towel finally gets warm.
Perfect example. Just because you have no idea how to do something like this, it doesn’t work in your world. Horizon with a radius of zero – that’s your position.
No offense, but if you have absolutely nothing constructive to contribute, it’s better to simply stay out of a thread for those who are interested.
FloHB123 schrieb:
How is it supposed to work to turn on the towel radiator early enough when showering so that the towel is actually warm? You really made me laugh with that. You’re also the first to explain to me that the device is meant to preheat a towel... I actually use it more for drying towels or to warm up the bathroom more than the underfloor heating can manage. But yes, where’s the problem in combining time, presence in the house, temperatures, and occupancy? It’s a one-time setup, then it just runs.
FloHB123 schrieb:
Lowering the external blinds (or venetian blinds) when the TV is on? That only makes sense if you would really be blinded. So not only time and general weather but also the exact position of the sun including cloud cover need to be taken into account. Otherwise, you sit in the dark as soon as the TV is switched on. Great 🙄 And so? That’s what a weather station with brightness sensors is for. All the data is available on the bus system anyway. Just combine it with some logic, done. You might find that “great,” but honestly, it’s one of the most beneficial comfort features I use. Normally, people would have given up having a window there exactly because it would constantly cause glare. This way, I have regular daylight, and when the TV is on, there’s no glare. It works the same in the living room as in the children’s rooms, which they also really appreciate. Besides, just because one single glare-free lowered blind is in use, you’re not suddenly sitting “in the dark.”