ᐅ Evaluating the Proposal and Technology of a Photovoltaic System
Created on: 30 Jan 2023 12:00
H
hanghaus2023
Hello,
I am planning to equip my house with a photovoltaic system.
Electricity consumption: 7100 kWh per year
Southwest orientation, roof pitch 45 degrees
Most affordable photovoltaic offer:
23 * modules
Jolywood JW-HD108N-420W (frame: black, backsheet: glass)
- Best price-performance ratio: high nominal power of 420 W per module and an efficiency of 21.51%.
- Linear power warranty for 30 years (minimum 87.4% after this period).
- 25 years product warranty from the manufacturer.
- Half-cut cells: two separate cell areas connected in series reduce shading losses.
- Front and back glass with anti-reflective technology.
23 * modules DC installation including scaffolding
1 * Sungrow SBR096 9.6 kWh
- High-voltage lithium iron phosphate battery with multi-level protection concept and comprehensive safety certifications.
- Up to 30A continuous charge and discharge current with high efficiency and 100% usable energy.
- Plug & Play, no wiring required between individual battery modules.
- Of the total price, €4,476.16 net is allocated to the battery storage.
1 * Sungrow Hybrid SH8.0RT
- Three-phase hybrid inverter for residential use.
- Fast charging/discharging to easily manage consumption peaks.
- High self-consumption through optimized integrated energy management system.
- Remote firmware updates and customizable settings.
- Quick and easy installation, commissioning via smartphone.
1 * AC installation for Sungrow SBR096 9.6 kWh battery with Sungrow inverter(s)
According to the provider, the meter cabinet does not incur any additional costs.
Note:
The cost for the required additional electricity meter is not included in the purchase price. Your local grid operator is responsible for installing this meter and will charge you separately for this service.
Net price: €26,192
The provider is relatively new to the market and has 150 ***** reviews on Google.
Previously, I received offers with lower specifications starting above €50,000.
Is there anything to consider regarding taxes?
Honestly, I have no expertise in this area. Is there an expert here who can technically and financially evaluate the most affordable offer for me?
Thank you very much for your help from
hanghaus2023
I am planning to equip my house with a photovoltaic system.
Electricity consumption: 7100 kWh per year
Southwest orientation, roof pitch 45 degrees
Most affordable photovoltaic offer:
23 * modules
Jolywood JW-HD108N-420W (frame: black, backsheet: glass)
- Best price-performance ratio: high nominal power of 420 W per module and an efficiency of 21.51%.
- Linear power warranty for 30 years (minimum 87.4% after this period).
- 25 years product warranty from the manufacturer.
- Half-cut cells: two separate cell areas connected in series reduce shading losses.
- Front and back glass with anti-reflective technology.
23 * modules DC installation including scaffolding
1 * Sungrow SBR096 9.6 kWh
- High-voltage lithium iron phosphate battery with multi-level protection concept and comprehensive safety certifications.
- Up to 30A continuous charge and discharge current with high efficiency and 100% usable energy.
- Plug & Play, no wiring required between individual battery modules.
- Of the total price, €4,476.16 net is allocated to the battery storage.
1 * Sungrow Hybrid SH8.0RT
- Three-phase hybrid inverter for residential use.
- Fast charging/discharging to easily manage consumption peaks.
- High self-consumption through optimized integrated energy management system.
- Remote firmware updates and customizable settings.
- Quick and easy installation, commissioning via smartphone.
1 * AC installation for Sungrow SBR096 9.6 kWh battery with Sungrow inverter(s)
According to the provider, the meter cabinet does not incur any additional costs.
Note:
The cost for the required additional electricity meter is not included in the purchase price. Your local grid operator is responsible for installing this meter and will charge you separately for this service.
Net price: €26,192
The provider is relatively new to the market and has 150 ***** reviews on Google.
Previously, I received offers with lower specifications starting above €50,000.
Is there anything to consider regarding taxes?
Honestly, I have no expertise in this area. Is there an expert here who can technically and financially evaluate the most affordable offer for me?
Thank you very much for your help from
hanghaus2023
RotorMotor schrieb:
Why wasn’t the full build done right away and the other half added later?
You can also feed in without a meter.
Why is another storage system planned? Here is a good reason for storage (if it’s not too expensive). The car charges continuously at 3.5 kW (7.7 hp) despite the constant changes between clouds and sun. This example is from today, and the car being charged was a Mazda MX30 (which can only do single-phase) that I have given to my daughter ;-)
Hello,
The (former) engineering powerhouse Germany…. In Japan and Korea, this seems to be completely standard by now. But here… (I’m currently filling out a registration for holiday care for my kids, and they actually prefer it by fax… *Argh*)
I think I might have a misconception or a misunderstanding. The inverters feed three-phase power into the household electrical system, right? Otherwise, there’s no way to manage outputs of 10 to 20 kW (11 to 22 hp), and single-phase feeding would create severe load imbalance on the network.
And the electric vehicle charging station should be able to charge the car with 11 kW (14.7 hp), right? The charging station doesn’t actually detect whether the electricity is currently coming from the grid or from the solar panels, does it?!
Or is your car really the issue, meaning it simply won’t take more than 3.6 kW (4.8 hp)?
Best regards,
Andreas
kati1337 schrieb:
I hope bidirectional charging will come eventually. Our car supports it too, but as far as I know, our house does not.
The (former) engineering powerhouse Germany…. In Japan and Korea, this seems to be completely standard by now. But here… (I’m currently filling out a registration for holiday care for my kids, and they actually prefer it by fax… *Argh*)
I think I might have a misconception or a misunderstanding. The inverters feed three-phase power into the household electrical system, right? Otherwise, there’s no way to manage outputs of 10 to 20 kW (11 to 22 hp), and single-phase feeding would create severe load imbalance on the network.
And the electric vehicle charging station should be able to charge the car with 11 kW (14.7 hp), right? The charging station doesn’t actually detect whether the electricity is currently coming from the grid or from the solar panels, does it?!
Or is your car really the issue, meaning it simply won’t take more than 3.6 kW (4.8 hp)?
Best regards,
Andreas
andimann schrieb:
Or is your car really the problem, meaning it just doesn’t accept more than 3.6 kW?Yes, it’s the car. We have the smallest MG4 model, MY22, which only charges AC single-phase. The wallbox can, of course, handle 11.
If the car could charge at 11 and be used as a storage device, it would be an option for us.
My last understanding was that this is not yet possible / not allowed in Germany. But I’m not sure about that.
andimann schrieb:
Hello,
The (former) engineering powerhouse Germany... In Japan and Korea, this is all completely standard. But here... (I'm currently filling out a registration form for holiday care for my kids, and they actually prefer to receive it by fax... *Argh* )
I seem to have a misconception or a problem understanding. The inverters feed the house grid three-phase, right? Otherwise, I can’t handle outputs of 10-20 kW at all, and feeding in single-phase would cause severe phase imbalance in the grid.
And the wallbox should be able to charge the car with 11 kW, right? The wallbox doesn’t even detect whether the power is coming from the grid or from the roof, does it?!
Or is your car really the problem, meaning it just doesn’t accept more than 3.6 kW?
Best regards,
Andreas The wallbox ideally communicates with the inverter and “sees” exactly what is coming from the roof, and can (depending on the wallbox) feed only surplus power, a mix of surplus and grid power, or in “fast mode” simply grid power (if available, of course also photovoltaic power) into the car. Many Japanese and other manufacturers, who thought they had to save something... ugh... only support single-phase charging (around 3.5 kW), but newer models do now allow 11 kW (all AC of course). DC fast charging for smaller EVs is often around 50 kW, for larger vehicles up to (I believe) 250 kW! These are then the 800 Volt cars.
Bidirectional wallboxes are already available for purchase in Germany. They can be installed as well. Unfortunately, regulations do not yet allow their use.
X
xMisterDx18 Sep 2023 23:11Does the warranty on the battery still apply if the vehicle is used as an energy storage system?
For example, VW voids the warranty if the battery is charged exclusively using DC charging. This is not considered "proper use" of the battery...
For example, VW voids the warranty if the battery is charged exclusively using DC charging. This is not considered "proper use" of the battery...
B
Buchsbaum19 Sep 2023 07:28Bidirectional charging is technically possible but currently not permitted. It is generally discouraged. Let’s put it that way.
The Hyundai Ioniq models already support it. Volkswagen planned to introduce bidirectional charging for the ID.3 starting January 1, 2022.
I don’t really understand what the problem is. It’s probably related to the resulting loss of tax revenue. It can’t be that someone charges their car cheaply somewhere and then runs their dishwasher at home in the evening using that electricity.
It would also be a solution to mitigate the so-called “dark doldrums.” In theory, it could enable a complete island mode operation. Then, a public electricity connection wouldn’t be necessary anymore. The 70–80 kWh (77–86 kWh) capacity in the car is enough for a typical consumption to last easily 2–3 days.
The bidirectional charging feature from VW has been announced for a long time and highly anticipated – the government has removed barriers for feeding electricity back into the grid with the “Easter Package.” The larger battery versions of the ID.3, ID.4, and ID.5 with 77 kilowatt-hours capacity are already technically prepared to be used as home storage and theoretically could even generate income for the customer.
That was in 2021! Now it’s almost 2024, and VW has rolled back everything again. Politically, it is not wanted.
The Hyundai Ioniq models already support it. Volkswagen planned to introduce bidirectional charging for the ID.3 starting January 1, 2022.
I don’t really understand what the problem is. It’s probably related to the resulting loss of tax revenue. It can’t be that someone charges their car cheaply somewhere and then runs their dishwasher at home in the evening using that electricity.
It would also be a solution to mitigate the so-called “dark doldrums.” In theory, it could enable a complete island mode operation. Then, a public electricity connection wouldn’t be necessary anymore. The 70–80 kWh (77–86 kWh) capacity in the car is enough for a typical consumption to last easily 2–3 days.
The bidirectional charging feature from VW has been announced for a long time and highly anticipated – the government has removed barriers for feeding electricity back into the grid with the “Easter Package.” The larger battery versions of the ID.3, ID.4, and ID.5 with 77 kilowatt-hours capacity are already technically prepared to be used as home storage and theoretically could even generate income for the customer.
That was in 2021! Now it’s almost 2024, and VW has rolled back everything again. Politically, it is not wanted.
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