Hello,
after a sleepless night, I’m seeking your help. We have a bathroom that is about 25 years old, which we inherited when buying the house. It’s now beyond repair, tiles are falling off, all the fixtures (Dornbracht!) are broken, etc.
We spoke with a highly recommended company in our region (Rhine-Main area) and they gave us a quote of over 50,000 euros. It’s a “maximum” offer, no extras, standard fixtures, house-brand tiles, etc. Maximum in the sense that everything that might possibly come up is included. No additional charges, according to them.
Part of the offer is, for example, to remove and replace the existing underfloor heating, and renew all the pipes in the bathroom. Reason: underfloor heating of this age is no longer reliable and should be replaced. We are wondering: is this really necessary?
The bathroom has a classic layout: bathtub and shower on one long side, double sink and toilet on the other long side. We only want to swap the positions of the bathtub and shower, with the shower to be built up and tiled. Everything else should remain as it is, just re-tiled with new sanitary fixtures and new taps. We also plan to lower the ceiling to install spotlights.
We had a budget of about 25,000 to 30,000 euros in mind, and assumed that might even allow for a strip of Bisazza glass mosaic. But the price calculated now, with relatively simple fittings that we do not like, is really depressing.
I understand that I can’t simply compare to prices from large online retailers, as contractors create mixed calculations including materials, installation, warranties, etc. Still, are we that far off with our budget? If not – how do I find a reasonable contractor without astronomical prices? One who really understands the job, who doesn’t insist on tile edge trims, who can properly do glass mosaic, and who is willing to listen rather than just follow their standard scheme?
We are definitely willing to invest to get a great bathroom. But 50,000 euros for a bathroom that still falls far short of our dream bathroom – that just won’t work.
Does anyone have any tips for us?
Many thanks and best regards,
Heli
after a sleepless night, I’m seeking your help. We have a bathroom that is about 25 years old, which we inherited when buying the house. It’s now beyond repair, tiles are falling off, all the fixtures (Dornbracht!) are broken, etc.
We spoke with a highly recommended company in our region (Rhine-Main area) and they gave us a quote of over 50,000 euros. It’s a “maximum” offer, no extras, standard fixtures, house-brand tiles, etc. Maximum in the sense that everything that might possibly come up is included. No additional charges, according to them.
Part of the offer is, for example, to remove and replace the existing underfloor heating, and renew all the pipes in the bathroom. Reason: underfloor heating of this age is no longer reliable and should be replaced. We are wondering: is this really necessary?
The bathroom has a classic layout: bathtub and shower on one long side, double sink and toilet on the other long side. We only want to swap the positions of the bathtub and shower, with the shower to be built up and tiled. Everything else should remain as it is, just re-tiled with new sanitary fixtures and new taps. We also plan to lower the ceiling to install spotlights.
We had a budget of about 25,000 to 30,000 euros in mind, and assumed that might even allow for a strip of Bisazza glass mosaic. But the price calculated now, with relatively simple fittings that we do not like, is really depressing.
I understand that I can’t simply compare to prices from large online retailers, as contractors create mixed calculations including materials, installation, warranties, etc. Still, are we that far off with our budget? If not – how do I find a reasonable contractor without astronomical prices? One who really understands the job, who doesn’t insist on tile edge trims, who can properly do glass mosaic, and who is willing to listen rather than just follow their standard scheme?
We are definitely willing to invest to get a great bathroom. But 50,000 euros for a bathroom that still falls far short of our dream bathroom – that just won’t work.
Does anyone have any tips for us?
Many thanks and best regards,
Heli
We generally do a lot of work on the house ourselves. We are not professional craftsmen, but we are quite handy and not afraid to tackle tasks. One challenge is time, as both of us work full-time. We want to demolish the bathroom ourselves.
What does it mean to "start a tender"?
I am happy to write down everything we have in mind.
What does it mean to "start a tender"?
I am happy to write down everything we have in mind.
Bathroom wishes (the bathtub and shower will remain in their current locations for cost reasons):
Bathtub:
- existing or new bathtub (either is fine) positioned with the head end against the wall
- if not too expensive: bathtub shortened to only 170 cm (67 inches) in length in favor of the shower, but with extra depth (we are all tall)
- bathtub fixtures don’t matter much
- platform with recessed bathtub remains, semicircular step removed, cutout above removed, bathtub flush with the wall on three sides
Shower:
- shower flush with the edge of the bathtub: L-shaped wall built on the platform (end of existing platform used as a seat in the shower, or removed completely), made of glass (like the photo of the black bathroom with moon wallpaper), or masonry, or drywall
- shower entrance at the window side, preferably without a door and rather narrow opening
- no rain showerhead
- step, as high as needed
- shower fixtures don’t matter much
- drain suitable for long hair
- if not too expensive: niche in the wall for shampoo and similar items
Toilet:
- toilet: standard white, no specific preference
Washbasin:
- washbasin unit 160 or preferably 180 cm (63 or 71 inches), mineral cast surface with two integrated basins and handleless drawers underneath (no model chosen yet)
- fixtures probably mounted on the washbasin unit for cost reasons, not wall-mounted concealed
- three-hole faucets, preferably Grohe Atrio or similar, with cross or lever handles
Tiles:
- light beige in a format that is still easy to install, porcelain stoneware, preferably with some surface texture and appearance like sandy beach or natural stone, e.g., Porcelanosa Dover Caliza or Porcelanosa Durango Bone 60 x 60 cm (24 x 24 inches)
- tiles mostly only on the floor and in the shower, behind the washbasin and possibly a row above the bathtub, the rest plastered
Luxuries we would like to include but can be omitted if necessary:
- wallpaper suitable for bathrooms above the bathtub, or on both long sides or even all around: Wallpepper Riflesso Bretagne Variant B (blue-gray, design can be freely adapted to the wall)
- back wall of the shower (if wallpaper is not continued inside the shower and shower walls are glass) and a strip above the washbasin: matching blue-gray glass mosaic tiles, e.g., Bisazza OP 25.03 – unsure if that might be too much visually
- above the washbasin two rather narrow recessed mirror cabinets (meaning the wall built out to the ceiling)
The ceiling might need to be lowered to illuminate a masonry shower from above with a spotlight.
Too complicated? In that case, just light tiles where necessary, the rest simply plastered and painted in color.
Bathtub:
- existing or new bathtub (either is fine) positioned with the head end against the wall
- if not too expensive: bathtub shortened to only 170 cm (67 inches) in length in favor of the shower, but with extra depth (we are all tall)
- bathtub fixtures don’t matter much
- platform with recessed bathtub remains, semicircular step removed, cutout above removed, bathtub flush with the wall on three sides
Shower:
- shower flush with the edge of the bathtub: L-shaped wall built on the platform (end of existing platform used as a seat in the shower, or removed completely), made of glass (like the photo of the black bathroom with moon wallpaper), or masonry, or drywall
- shower entrance at the window side, preferably without a door and rather narrow opening
- no rain showerhead
- step, as high as needed
- shower fixtures don’t matter much
- drain suitable for long hair
- if not too expensive: niche in the wall for shampoo and similar items
Toilet:
- toilet: standard white, no specific preference
Washbasin:
- washbasin unit 160 or preferably 180 cm (63 or 71 inches), mineral cast surface with two integrated basins and handleless drawers underneath (no model chosen yet)
- fixtures probably mounted on the washbasin unit for cost reasons, not wall-mounted concealed
- three-hole faucets, preferably Grohe Atrio or similar, with cross or lever handles
Tiles:
- light beige in a format that is still easy to install, porcelain stoneware, preferably with some surface texture and appearance like sandy beach or natural stone, e.g., Porcelanosa Dover Caliza or Porcelanosa Durango Bone 60 x 60 cm (24 x 24 inches)
- tiles mostly only on the floor and in the shower, behind the washbasin and possibly a row above the bathtub, the rest plastered
Luxuries we would like to include but can be omitted if necessary:
- wallpaper suitable for bathrooms above the bathtub, or on both long sides or even all around: Wallpepper Riflesso Bretagne Variant B (blue-gray, design can be freely adapted to the wall)
- back wall of the shower (if wallpaper is not continued inside the shower and shower walls are glass) and a strip above the washbasin: matching blue-gray glass mosaic tiles, e.g., Bisazza OP 25.03 – unsure if that might be too much visually
- above the washbasin two rather narrow recessed mirror cabinets (meaning the wall built out to the ceiling)
The ceiling might need to be lowered to illuminate a masonry shower from above with a spotlight.
Too complicated? In that case, just light tiles where necessary, the rest simply plastered and painted in color.
B
Buschreiter4 Dec 2022 21:44Helisara schrieb:
I understand the company to mean that they never just do cosmetic work on bathrooms but always fully gut and rebuild them, because that is their standard. They also do things like mitered tile edges, for example.
However, we are planning to discuss this with them again. From the start, we had signaled that we didn’t want the costs to escalate, and our initial proposal was to keep the layout as it is. Apparently, the company does not want to agree to that. Really? Ideally, the relationship between the contractor and the client should be a collaboration. After all, it’s the client’s preferences that matter. Warranty reasons can’t justify it. Our plumber understandably insists that everything involving water systems comes from their work. He provides valuable advice and experience during planning and execution, which I appreciate. But if a company tries to impose its “philosophy” on me, I start looking for another.
By the way: If you dye your own hair or rinse after dyeing, using solid surface material (mineral casting) is not a good idea 😉
B
Buschreiter4 Dec 2022 22:11Perhaps an undermount washbasin made of sanitary ceramic would be suitable? Mineral cast resin is quite sensitive to scratches. Eventually, even car polish won’t remove them anymore (this was a recommendation from the plumbing supplier).
Helisara schrieb:
Dye hair? Me?? 😱 No way. Maybe at some point, though. Or them? Tints in day creams, etc., can also affect surfaces.
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