ᐅ Enlarge and completely renovate a single-family home, or demolish and rebuild?
Created on: 19 Dec 2021 18:54
Z
zizou89
Hello everyone,
Here is the situation:
We have the opportunity to buy a plot of land (600 sqm (approximately 6458 sqft)) with a house from the 1960s that offers 105 sqm (approximately 1130 sqft) of living space over two floors for 150,000 €. The value of the land alone (land reference value) is 130,000 €.
For us, however, the house is too small. We would like to undertake the following measures (the development plan allows all of these):
1. Extend the house by 3 meters (about 10 feet) to the rear and 3 meters (about 10 feet) to the side.
2. Add extra floors.
3. Install a new roof.
4. Replace the exterior facade.
5. Complete interior refurbishment.
In other words: we basically want to redo everything.
Would this be financially worthwhile, or would demolition and rebuilding make more sense? Are there any tips regarding funding options (KfW programs) or similar?
Please excuse me, as I am (still) a complete beginner. I understand that it is impossible to predict costs here, but maybe there are people who have undertaken a similar project 🙂
I would appreciate any information.
Here is the situation:
We have the opportunity to buy a plot of land (600 sqm (approximately 6458 sqft)) with a house from the 1960s that offers 105 sqm (approximately 1130 sqft) of living space over two floors for 150,000 €. The value of the land alone (land reference value) is 130,000 €.
For us, however, the house is too small. We would like to undertake the following measures (the development plan allows all of these):
1. Extend the house by 3 meters (about 10 feet) to the rear and 3 meters (about 10 feet) to the side.
2. Add extra floors.
3. Install a new roof.
4. Replace the exterior facade.
5. Complete interior refurbishment.
In other words: we basically want to redo everything.
Would this be financially worthwhile, or would demolition and rebuilding make more sense? Are there any tips regarding funding options (KfW programs) or similar?
Please excuse me, as I am (still) a complete beginner. I understand that it is impossible to predict costs here, but maybe there are people who have undertaken a similar project 🙂
I would appreciate any information.
11ant schrieb:
So you’re now doing a full excavation and only using the foundation pit, even though the finished floor level would have been suitable height-wise as well?Almost, the pit will be dug a bit deeper. Height would have been the next compromise. The house, or rather the existing basement, currently stands about 1 meter (3 feet) above ground level, meaning you go up a staircase at the front and then down a staircase to the garden. None of that is ideal. Also, the entire floor plan is simply too small.11ant schrieb:
No, on the one hand it is quite normal that there are no ceiling plans (and never were). On the other hand, there would only be something by chance anyway, since a house from around 1920 has already experienced the Second World War. More archives were bombed out than Napoleon ever said that stuff from the Caesar era could go into the shredder ;-)
In the Middle Ages, there was still a lot of chaos and urban settlement forms were still new. The main driver of building regulation development was devastating fires. The first development plans aimed at controlling irregular street edges by specifying building line setbacks – so development plans were still very simple: there was a building line along the street side, and a ridge height regulation of “not higher than the church tower.” Even during the imperial period, there were few regulations: for example, in Berlin there was a cornice height regulation based on the idea that a house façade, hypothetically like a falling tree, should collapse before reaching the row of houses opposite, and in courtyards the turning radius of the fire engine was the most important factor. Requiring structural calculations for building applications is a rather recent practice, and wooden beam ceilings did not contain any steel at all.
Wooden beam ceilings are very friendly to building forensics, but in this case, that only applies to the one between the top floor and the attic. The ceiling that needs to be clarified here is the one between the ground floor and the top floor. This is not the case for us. We have two thick files for our house. They include every little detail, even some disputes before it was built. There is more documentation than one might expect. Unfortunately, though, no building plans.
We have made significant progress since we met with the architectural drafter at the house, and she brought along the development plan. This means the roof design is fixed and cannot be changed.
Our likely approach will be as follows:
1. The roof will remain as is, but will be insulated and retiled.
2. The brick facade will be covered either with a curtain wall facade or plastered 😉 (please don’t be too harsh on me).
3. The interior will undergo a complete renovation, including a new heating system with underfloor heating, new screed, new wiring, etc.
4. Next to the house, a 4x14 meter (13x46 feet) extension will be built using timber frame construction. This will contain the parents’ section: bedroom, bathroom, and dressing room, all on the ground floor (which is necessary since we are only allowed to build a single-story house).
Visually, we imagine the house to look somewhat like this, in terms of color, the dormer, and also the dark window frames, etc.

Along with a long extension reflecting the timber of the dormer, similar to this:

New plan here: I have marked in gray the walls where an opening would need to be made. Do you think this is structurally feasible?

The bathroom and parents’ bedroom practically overlook the garden. Spa retreat or mood killer? 😀
Is a passage through the dressing room into the parents’ bedroom okay, or what do you think?
Please be completely honest. Any kind of criticism helps me a lot 😉
Thanks so much for your feedback!
Our likely approach will be as follows:
1. The roof will remain as is, but will be insulated and retiled.
2. The brick facade will be covered either with a curtain wall facade or plastered 😉 (please don’t be too harsh on me).
3. The interior will undergo a complete renovation, including a new heating system with underfloor heating, new screed, new wiring, etc.
4. Next to the house, a 4x14 meter (13x46 feet) extension will be built using timber frame construction. This will contain the parents’ section: bedroom, bathroom, and dressing room, all on the ground floor (which is necessary since we are only allowed to build a single-story house).
Visually, we imagine the house to look somewhat like this, in terms of color, the dormer, and also the dark window frames, etc.
Along with a long extension reflecting the timber of the dormer, similar to this:
New plan here: I have marked in gray the walls where an opening would need to be made. Do you think this is structurally feasible?
The bathroom and parents’ bedroom practically overlook the garden. Spa retreat or mood killer? 😀
Is a passage through the dressing room into the parents’ bedroom okay, or what do you think?
Please be completely honest. Any kind of criticism helps me a lot 😉
Thanks so much for your feedback!
That looks like a feasible plan. Whether the structural design works will be calculated by the structural engineer. The sequence of the dressing room, bedroom, and bathroom is viewed differently here. The arguments will surely be presented. For us, it would be dressing room, bathroom, and bedroom.
If she has Sissi or Top Gun in the home theater, or he needs to leave early, it is quieter to sleep in the rear.
The living room has a lot of foot traffic.
If she has Sissi or Top Gun in the home theater, or he needs to leave early, it is quieter to sleep in the rear.
The living room has a lot of foot traffic.
zizou89 schrieb:
We have made significant progress since we visited the drafter at home, and she brought the development plan with her. This means the roof shape is fixed. It is not allowed to be built differently. WE have not progressed as long as you do not share the development plan with us. So far, nothing has been proposed that seemed unfeasible to me (with four decades of experience in this field). By the way, the current house is single-story, and attaching a shipping container with a flat roof to the house does not seem appropriate.
zizou89 schrieb:
New plan here: I marked the walls in gray where openings would need to be made. Do you think that is structurally possible?
[...] Please be completely honest. Any kind of criticism helps me. What’s the point if you don’t accept the criticism and still draw nonsense like partially removing existing exterior walls? – if steel isn’t playing the role of a Rolex, almost anything is possible structurally, but then there’s no budget left for anything else ;-)
Which basic software are you even using for your floor plan tinkering?
It’s almost an art to carelessly sketch proportions whose correct dimensions you know!
For us readers this is just exhausting, but for you it seriously diminishes the chance to gain clarity :-(
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
11ant schrieb:
We haven’t made any progress yet because you haven’t shared the development plan with us. So far, nothing proposed seems unfeasible to me (with four decades of experience in this field). By the way, the current house is single-story, and attaching a shipping container with a flat roof to it doesn’t seem appropriate.
Why bother if you don’t accept the criticism and draw nonsense again, like peeling away parts of the existing exterior wall? If steel isn't acting like a Rolex, almost anything is possible structurally—but then there’s no money left for anything else ;-)
What beginner software are you even using for your floor plan tinkering? It’s almost an art to sketch proportions incorrectly when you know the correct dimensions! For us readers, it’s just exhausting, but for you, it costs you a crucial understanding :-( Which software can I use? I really have no idea, as you can tell.
For me, the main goal is to be able to explain to an architect soon what I might want, without just saying, “Here’s my plan, finish it for me 😀”
I’m already trying my best to make it at least somewhat understandable.
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