ᐅ Air-to-water heat pump combined with underfloor heating is not functioning properly
Created on: 22 Sep 2021 15:34
_
_Ugeen_Hello everyone,
We moved into our single-family house in the middle of the year and are now using our air-to-water heat pump (Daikin Altherma 3 R ECH2O) for the first time. In the rooms, we decided against the standard analog controllers and chose digital controllers instead. After several discussions with Daikin and the controller manufacturer, I now understand that a valve is only opened or closed when I want to increase the temperature or not.
With the Daikin system, I can set a target room temperature. According to Daikin, this target value does not represent the minimum temperature per room but rather the "preheating value," if I understand correctly. This value was previously set at 23°C (73°F).
In the bedroom, I set the digital controller so that heating only starts when the temperature drops below 18°C (64°F). Despite this setting, the room temperature has always been 22-23°C (72-73°F), although the digital controller shows that heating is off. After changing the target room temperature from 23 to 21°C (73 to 70°F), it got a bit cooler. However, in the bathroom, heating is supposed to activate below 23°C (73°F). The temperature there is 22°C (72°F), and the digital controller indicates that heating is active. Yet, the room does not get warmer, and the floor heating does not noticeably warm up either.
Conclusion: I still have not understood the logic behind the target room temperature setting. In our previous apartment, we also had underfloor heating with analog controllers that I could adjust higher or lower. That worked wonderfully, and I felt like I could control the temperature. Here, with the air-to-water heat pump, I don’t have that feeling. Also, the towel warmers do not get truly warm (only lukewarm), which Daikin says is normal even when the dial is set to 5. This is apparently because it is a low-temperature heat pump. Without the electric booster to warm the towel warmers, they are essentially ineffective. Is this normal? Could there be an error, or do I need to use completely different settings?
If anyone has experience with this topic, I would greatly appreciate your feedback. At the moment, I feel a bit lost on this subject.
We moved into our single-family house in the middle of the year and are now using our air-to-water heat pump (Daikin Altherma 3 R ECH2O) for the first time. In the rooms, we decided against the standard analog controllers and chose digital controllers instead. After several discussions with Daikin and the controller manufacturer, I now understand that a valve is only opened or closed when I want to increase the temperature or not.
With the Daikin system, I can set a target room temperature. According to Daikin, this target value does not represent the minimum temperature per room but rather the "preheating value," if I understand correctly. This value was previously set at 23°C (73°F).
In the bedroom, I set the digital controller so that heating only starts when the temperature drops below 18°C (64°F). Despite this setting, the room temperature has always been 22-23°C (72-73°F), although the digital controller shows that heating is off. After changing the target room temperature from 23 to 21°C (73 to 70°F), it got a bit cooler. However, in the bathroom, heating is supposed to activate below 23°C (73°F). The temperature there is 22°C (72°F), and the digital controller indicates that heating is active. Yet, the room does not get warmer, and the floor heating does not noticeably warm up either.
Conclusion: I still have not understood the logic behind the target room temperature setting. In our previous apartment, we also had underfloor heating with analog controllers that I could adjust higher or lower. That worked wonderfully, and I felt like I could control the temperature. Here, with the air-to-water heat pump, I don’t have that feeling. Also, the towel warmers do not get truly warm (only lukewarm), which Daikin says is normal even when the dial is set to 5. This is apparently because it is a low-temperature heat pump. Without the electric booster to warm the towel warmers, they are essentially ineffective. Is this normal? Could there be an error, or do I need to use completely different settings?
If anyone has experience with this topic, I would greatly appreciate your feedback. At the moment, I feel a bit lost on this subject.
I
Interrupt22 Sep 2021 16:07_Ugeen_ schrieb:
The towel radiators also don’t get really warm (only lukewarm), which Daikin says is normal, even when the dial is turned to 5. This is probably because it’s a low-temperature heat pump. That means without the electric boost to warm the towel radiators, they are basically useless. Is this normal?As far as I know, the heat pump supplies a certain flow temperature for the entire house, typically below body temperature, which for towel radiators only results in the lukewarm feeling you described. So yes, this is normal.
Our builder already told us this during the sales talk. After that, we ruled out using towel radiators.
First of all, most of the observations described are actually normal for a modern heat pump with underfloor heating (radiant floor heating). Furthermore, for efficient operation of the heating system, using individual room control is rather harmful or unnecessary. Typically, the desired temperature is set directly on the heat pump and the valves on the heating circuit manifold, which then maintain it. Strongly different temperatures are not possible or only possible with difficulty, because everything within the same thermal envelope warms each other up.
Bathrooms often have a limited floor area and a higher heating demand, which usually results in insufficient heating capacity. That’s why additional heaters are often planned. However, in low-temperature systems, it only makes limited sense to integrate these into the “normal” heating circuit, since it operates with low temperatures. You therefore need a large surface area to achieve effective heating output. It is better to use electrically operated heaters for this purpose. These are available in classic forms, such as towel radiators. You can check (or have checked) whether your towel radiator can accommodate a heating element. This is typically inserted at the bottom of the towel radiator and connected to a wall outlet. Retrofitting is not exactly easy and should be carried out by a professional.
Alternatively, you can look into other types of heaters. There are attractive infrared panels or less aesthetically pleasing ceramic heat emitters. Or, quite traditionally, fan heaters.
Bathrooms often have a limited floor area and a higher heating demand, which usually results in insufficient heating capacity. That’s why additional heaters are often planned. However, in low-temperature systems, it only makes limited sense to integrate these into the “normal” heating circuit, since it operates with low temperatures. You therefore need a large surface area to achieve effective heating output. It is better to use electrically operated heaters for this purpose. These are available in classic forms, such as towel radiators. You can check (or have checked) whether your towel radiator can accommodate a heating element. This is typically inserted at the bottom of the towel radiator and connected to a wall outlet. Retrofitting is not exactly easy and should be carried out by a professional.
Alternatively, you can look into other types of heaters. There are attractive infrared panels or less aesthetically pleasing ceramic heat emitters. Or, quite traditionally, fan heaters.
From the initial post, I understand that there are no errors. The heat pump is doing exactly what it is supposed to do.
You can disregard the room controllers. They are just decorative. Or, they can act as an emergency stop. However, in that case, you would have to run your heat pump at a higher setting than necessary, and who wants that?
The behavior you describe is exactly how a heat pump should operate. In your apartment, you probably had underfloor heating that was not powered by a heat pump, which explains your surprise that it worked there but not in the house. Am I correct in this assumption?
You can disregard the room controllers. They are just decorative. Or, they can act as an emergency stop. However, in that case, you would have to run your heat pump at a higher setting than necessary, and who wants that?
The behavior you describe is exactly how a heat pump should operate. In your apartment, you probably had underfloor heating that was not powered by a heat pump, which explains your surprise that it worked there but not in the house. Am I correct in this assumption?
Similar topics