Hello everyone,
finally, we have reached an important step… the plot is signed for.
We want to build with an architect and already have some ideas about what we like and what we don’t.
We definitely want to give the architect the opportunity to apply their expertise regarding the floor plan… maybe they can convince us.
But if not, we are currently (almost) quite happy with this self-drawn floor plan.
A few key facts…
Plot size: 660 sqm (about 7100 sq ft), floor area ratio 0.4, no slope, approximately 26m x 25m (85 ft x 82 ft)
Longest building side allowed: max. 15m (about 49 ft)
L-shaped bungalow with covered terrace (southwest side)
We want to build with a basement. This should have windows with natural daylight behind the garage on the east side. There will be 2–3 living rooms down there (playroom, hobby room, later for the kids or grandparents if necessary).
The roof will not be converted into a living space — 20-22° (degrees) pitch, hip roof, for aesthetic reasons.
We know that a basement is more expensive than a second floor, etc. The budget is roughly 650,000–700,000 (currency).
Utility room, laundry room, sauna, etc. will all be located in the basement since there is enough space. 🙂
Now to the floor plan:
We like an open design with a large entrance area.
What we like about this floor plan:
Children’s area separated from parents
Connection from the garage with access to the storage room and basement
Access from kitchen and living room to the terrace possible
Master bedroom with direct view of the garden on the southeast side (in summer the shutters are closed anyway)
Children’s rooms with windows facing west, slightly southwest.
Open questions…
Are the children’s rooms too narrow at almost 3m (about 10 ft)?
Is the living room too narrow at almost 4.5m (about 15 ft)?
The L-shape at the terrace is about 3m (10 ft) deep — here we could possibly adjust a bit to enlarge the children’s rooms.
My wife doesn’t like that the kitchen is visible directly from the entrance area.
(I prefer the kitchen visibility over the living room couch). What do you think is better or worse?
The kitchen window is on the south side, possibly too much sun… maybe we should add an awning if needed.
I can’t fit a second toilet elsewhere without making the children’s rooms even smaller… so it will remain a guest toilet for the parents.
Is a door between the entrance area and the living area for a windbreak useful, or unnecessary? (We have underfloor heating.)
(Maybe a hidden interior door, but I’m unsure what happens if it gets damaged.)
The floor area ratio will be tight… 15m x 15m = 225 sqm (about 11,200 sq ft) + garage + driveway… we might need to reduce the width a bit.
660 sqm x 0.4 = 264 sqm (about 2,840 sq ft).
I have seen many floor plans here… wishes and practicality have to match somewhere.
I’m really curious about the experts’ opinions…
Is it rubbish or usable?
Thanks
finally, we have reached an important step… the plot is signed for.
We want to build with an architect and already have some ideas about what we like and what we don’t.
We definitely want to give the architect the opportunity to apply their expertise regarding the floor plan… maybe they can convince us.
But if not, we are currently (almost) quite happy with this self-drawn floor plan.
A few key facts…
Plot size: 660 sqm (about 7100 sq ft), floor area ratio 0.4, no slope, approximately 26m x 25m (85 ft x 82 ft)
Longest building side allowed: max. 15m (about 49 ft)
L-shaped bungalow with covered terrace (southwest side)
We want to build with a basement. This should have windows with natural daylight behind the garage on the east side. There will be 2–3 living rooms down there (playroom, hobby room, later for the kids or grandparents if necessary).
The roof will not be converted into a living space — 20-22° (degrees) pitch, hip roof, for aesthetic reasons.
We know that a basement is more expensive than a second floor, etc. The budget is roughly 650,000–700,000 (currency).
Utility room, laundry room, sauna, etc. will all be located in the basement since there is enough space. 🙂
Now to the floor plan:
We like an open design with a large entrance area.
What we like about this floor plan:
Children’s area separated from parents
Connection from the garage with access to the storage room and basement
Access from kitchen and living room to the terrace possible
Master bedroom with direct view of the garden on the southeast side (in summer the shutters are closed anyway)
Children’s rooms with windows facing west, slightly southwest.
Open questions…
Are the children’s rooms too narrow at almost 3m (about 10 ft)?
Is the living room too narrow at almost 4.5m (about 15 ft)?
The L-shape at the terrace is about 3m (10 ft) deep — here we could possibly adjust a bit to enlarge the children’s rooms.
My wife doesn’t like that the kitchen is visible directly from the entrance area.
(I prefer the kitchen visibility over the living room couch). What do you think is better or worse?
The kitchen window is on the south side, possibly too much sun… maybe we should add an awning if needed.
I can’t fit a second toilet elsewhere without making the children’s rooms even smaller… so it will remain a guest toilet for the parents.
Is a door between the entrance area and the living area for a windbreak useful, or unnecessary? (We have underfloor heating.)
(Maybe a hidden interior door, but I’m unsure what happens if it gets damaged.)
The floor area ratio will be tight… 15m x 15m = 225 sqm (about 11,200 sq ft) + garage + driveway… we might need to reduce the width a bit.
660 sqm x 0.4 = 264 sqm (about 2,840 sq ft).
I have seen many floor plans here… wishes and practicality have to match somewhere.
I’m really curious about the experts’ opinions…
Is it rubbish or usable?
Thanks
M
Myrna_Loy16 Apr 2021 15:57I think the point is that an unused basement is easier to ignore than an empty attic? That's how I understand the argument. Basically buried and out of sight. 🙂
Myrna_Loy schrieb:
The insistence on exactly this design with only minor suggestions for improvement – which simply aren't possible with this design because too many things are fundamentally wrong – already makes me feel sorry for the architect. Here lies the core of the problem: the original poster has fallen head over heels for the Weiss Vita model home. Unfortunately, its overlap with their personal needs is only about thirty percent (which is why I myself don’t recognize the "model" in their own design). Understandably, there is a concern that an architect might prioritize the seventy percent of needs outside this overlap even more than we do here, and as a result, the recognizable features might shrink below the threshold of visibility even to the original poster’s eyes – possibly leaving only the door handle as a reminder (Daffy Duck fans will know what I mean *LOL*).
Iotafreak schrieb:
After that comes the possibility of studying, moving out, etc.... Then you have the entire second floor completely unused... Honestly, I see a very small difference to the right of the decimal point between having a floor or a wing left empty – just because the clients are reluctant to build the house for a friend and for themselves, and insist that the house be occupied by an enemy until death or at least until care level IV, solely because it bears a symbolic resemblance to the Weiss Vita from their youth. Yes, people grow and change and that is just a common experience, not a law – one can also put all one’s energy into resisting change and, like Oskar Matzerath, prefer not to grow anymore. My late grandmother used to say in such cases that a person’s will is their kingdom (ironically, she worked at Edeka).
ypg schrieb:
We never advised you to have “a second floor”! Well, perhaps not in those exact words. But I do recall us repeatedly advising against the obsession with having everything on one floor at all costs, or at least trying to do so.
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
M
Myrna_Loy16 Apr 2021 16:03You can arrange everything on a single level, but this is not practical with the closed bungalow floor plan. If you want a parent wing, a living area, and a children’s wing, you need a different floor plan—or you end up with unreasonably large corridors or an atrium.
Myrna_Loy schrieb:
I think the point is that an unused basement is easier to just ignore than an empty attic? That’s how I understand the argument. Basically buried and out of sight. 🙂 That’s true, burying €250,000 (about $270,000) is quite close to that 😎
I
Iotafreak16 Apr 2021 16:16Evolith schrieb:
Sure. I’ve attached the complete plan.
The TV is located on the partition wall between the kitchen and living area, or rather mounted there. A minor downside: the sun shines on it during the day. It doesn’t bother me much, and my husband always lowers the blinds on the large window. A good TV compensates for that quite well.
We initially wanted a low roof pitch. Due to a planning error (a hipped roof was not permitted), we had to switch to a half-hipped roof, which required a significantly larger roof extension. Now I have to say, I think it’s great. We have plenty of headroom up there, and the house reminds me a bit of the reed-thatched coastal cottages I really like.
Only about one-third of the terrace is covered. However, we have a huge one measuring 5x9m (16x30 ft). In front of the bedroom window, a 5x5m (16x16 ft) roof cover will be added in the next few years.
What helped us a lot was seeing the inside of a bungalow once. I still remember my grandparents’ bungalow, typical for its time with a very long corridor and extremely separated private areas. I always found that frustrating. If you ever pass through NRW, feel free to drop by 😉 Great, thanks again....
I’m currently on the go but want to take a closer look at this later in peace....
Seeing it in person would be really great... BW is not exactly around the corner though.... Thanks again....
I
Iotafreak16 Apr 2021 16:39ypg schrieb:
Let’s slow down here… not that any of us didn’t understand before 😉
We never recommended adding “a second floor”!
Define “basement”! Isn’t a basement considered a “floor”?
By the way, it’s more common to refer to levels as “storeys” or “floors,” and then there’s the definition of a “half-storey”… but let’s get to the point:
So you’re planning a ground floor plus basement, because a ground floor plus finished attic means two floors, and ground floor plus basement equals two floors too? 🤨
You’re bothered by a staircase leading to the attic, but not by one going to the basement. 🤨
You’re putting necessary rooms like laundry, utility, storage in your other level (the basement), even though the staircase might become a problem someday. 🤨
You’re making an argument that doesn’t hold up, since you’re planning two storeys anyway, which means a staircase. If you get unlucky and develop knee problems at age 50, that staircase will be an obstacle.
Moreover, you’re planning “2-3 living rooms with natural light” in the basement. Meaning: additional living spaces there, fully finished with electricity, bathroom (you mentioned parents, so perhaps?), (→ sewage lifting system), heating, ventilation, proper daylight, and a ceiling height that turns a basement room into a habitable space that is allowed and approved for occupancy. Daylight only comes into basements through special daylight shafts, i.e., proper windows and a significant excavation—there are several solutions for this. However, these are always located along the exterior walls (since they’re basement windows) and pose a safety risk for kids playing in the yard (not to mention burglar protection). These windows must be secured, but still allow for a second emergency exit → fall protection, escape route from inside to outside. This all turns a simple basement into a livable basement.
That means: 180 sq.m basement = 180,000€
180 sq.m basement finished as living space (I’ll estimate half, since utility and laundry rooms don’t have to be finished, but ceiling height needs to be adequate), so 90 sq.m basement + 90 sq.m living basement = 300,000€
The attic remains unheated, but you’ve got 180 sq.m of space that nobody sees because it’s hidden in the basement. Most of that space isn’t really needed anyway (180 sq.m basement is quite large), and if the kids party down there, you lose two rooms on the ground floor.
As I said before, you’re not the first to consider a bungalow design.
According to your argument, it would be more logical to let your basement staircase lead up to the attic, since that space is already there. Just skip the basement entirely.
Rooms that become necessary in old age or with knee problems can be planned on the ground floor (remember: “we want everything on one level…”). Small freezer room, laundry room next to the kitchen… all bungalow-style, all for you.
A room close to the parents’ bedroom for small children, plus two rooms and a bathroom in the finished attic that the kids can move into once they start school. This construction effort is minimal, maybe about 50,000€. Windows with a view of the sky instead of the concrete look of a light well.
That would be a clear separation of spaces (children/parents). And when the kids move out, those two attic rooms of 40 sq.m don’t hurt if left unused, converted into a gym, or used for grandchildren visiting. The important thing is that you have your level, and the space upstairs doesn’t interfere.
What’s the catch?
You invest 250,000€ more for less comfort, end up with a huge basement that you might not even be able to access for laundry in the worst case, plus two empty rooms on the ground floor… and think: I should’ve put the freezer and laundry room here instead…Phew, this is exhausting and frustrating at the same time… If I wanted to know whether to build a basement, I would have asked that… I asked for advice on the room layout, not for somebody to talk me out of my plans… I have mentioned the comparison to a Porsche and our wishes several times already, but you seem to have made up your mind… Everything that doesn’t fit the norm gets discouraged… One last time: 20cm (8 inches) thick hip roof because we like the look. With basement for the reasons given. Why is there an attempt here to talk people out of that? I don’t understand. I want to build my house according to my wishes, not to be talked out of it every time by someone who doesn’t like it… please stop. Thank you.
Similar topics