ᐅ Comparability of Costs: Architect vs. General Contractor
Created on: 4 Mar 2021 16:57
A
askforafriend
Hello dear forum,
We are currently in the planning phase for a single-family house. We have requested quotes from several general contractors and have also spoken with a very approachable architect. We would be happy to present our building project (BVH) in detail at a later stage!
Overall, we much prefer the transparency and approach of the architect compared to the initial consultation with the general contractor. We understand that over time, we will also speak with an architect/planner through the general contractor who will discuss details with us. We have thoroughly researched the advantages and disadvantages both in this forum and through various guides.
At this stage, our main focus is on comparing the cost estimates from the general contractors versus the architect. The general contractor states the costs as a fixed price (based on the building and scope of services description) plus our additional requests (extra electrical outlets, KfW standard, etc.). A rough total for the house including additional requests was, for example, 410,000 euros. This naturally also includes architectural/planning/engineering services according to the scope of work description.
Land leveling.
Discussions about your building project together with you during planning and construction meetings. Preparation of building permit/planning permission documents at a scale of 1:100 in the required number of copies for the authorities.
You will receive an additional set of plans for your personal records.
Development of working drawings (scale 1:50) as well as any necessary detailed drawings.
Creation of structural engineering plans (standard structural design for the respective house type) including any required building physics reports for thermal and fire protection.
Calculation of energy demand and preparation of the energy performance certificate. A copy will be provided for your records.
Preparation of public funding applications, if required.
Site management and construction supervision up to handover of the house.
Support during the warranty period.
When we first met with the architect, he took out a book labeled BKI to provide a rough estimate of the feasibility of the building project based on this data. He calculated roughly 3,000 euros per square meter and 150 square meters (1,615 square feet) of living space, resulting in a total of 450,000 euros.
The big question now is: Does this amount exclude his fees or do these average construction costs per square meter already include the services mentioned above? This might be a somewhat naive question, but it’s really unclear to us. Is there a list of costs that are included in these average rates?
We have an appointment with him next week for a more detailed cost assessment.
Thank you very much for your feedback, and I wish you a pleasant week.
We are currently in the planning phase for a single-family house. We have requested quotes from several general contractors and have also spoken with a very approachable architect. We would be happy to present our building project (BVH) in detail at a later stage!
Overall, we much prefer the transparency and approach of the architect compared to the initial consultation with the general contractor. We understand that over time, we will also speak with an architect/planner through the general contractor who will discuss details with us. We have thoroughly researched the advantages and disadvantages both in this forum and through various guides.
At this stage, our main focus is on comparing the cost estimates from the general contractors versus the architect. The general contractor states the costs as a fixed price (based on the building and scope of services description) plus our additional requests (extra electrical outlets, KfW standard, etc.). A rough total for the house including additional requests was, for example, 410,000 euros. This naturally also includes architectural/planning/engineering services according to the scope of work description.
Land leveling.
Discussions about your building project together with you during planning and construction meetings. Preparation of building permit/planning permission documents at a scale of 1:100 in the required number of copies for the authorities.
You will receive an additional set of plans for your personal records.
Development of working drawings (scale 1:50) as well as any necessary detailed drawings.
Creation of structural engineering plans (standard structural design for the respective house type) including any required building physics reports for thermal and fire protection.
Calculation of energy demand and preparation of the energy performance certificate. A copy will be provided for your records.
Preparation of public funding applications, if required.
Site management and construction supervision up to handover of the house.
Support during the warranty period.
When we first met with the architect, he took out a book labeled BKI to provide a rough estimate of the feasibility of the building project based on this data. He calculated roughly 3,000 euros per square meter and 150 square meters (1,615 square feet) of living space, resulting in a total of 450,000 euros.
The big question now is: Does this amount exclude his fees or do these average construction costs per square meter already include the services mentioned above? This might be a somewhat naive question, but it’s really unclear to us. Is there a list of costs that are included in these average rates?
We have an appointment with him next week for a more detailed cost assessment.
Thank you very much for your feedback, and I wish you a pleasant week.
askforafriend13 Mar 2021 09:51So, dear forum – the offer from the preferred architect has now arrived.
It is a calculation according to HOAI, Fee Zone III, and is structured as follows:
The billable costs amount to 380,000 euros net.
For energy consulting services (the architect provides these themselves), an additional €4,975 applies.
Additional costs amount to 3% of the contract sum = €1,594.22 (this likely covers travel, postage, etc.; is this reasonable?)
In total, this amounts to €54,734.84 net. After deducting a 15% discount, the net total is €46,524.61, resulting in a gross final sum of €55,364.29.
What do you think? What stands out to me is that work phase 9 (LPH 9) is not included – what could be the reason for this?
Best regards and have a nice weekend!
It is a calculation according to HOAI, Fee Zone III, and is structured as follows:
The billable costs amount to 380,000 euros net.
For energy consulting services (the architect provides these themselves), an additional €4,975 applies.
Additional costs amount to 3% of the contract sum = €1,594.22 (this likely covers travel, postage, etc.; is this reasonable?)
In total, this amounts to €54,734.84 net. After deducting a 15% discount, the net total is €46,524.61, resulting in a gross final sum of €55,364.29.
What do you think? What stands out to me is that work phase 9 (LPH 9) is not included – what could be the reason for this?
Best regards and have a nice weekend!
askforafriend schrieb:
So dear forum – the offer from the preferred architect has now arrived.
It is a calculation based on HOAI, fee zone III, and is structured as follows:
The eligible costs amount to 380,000 euros net.
For energy consulting services (the architect does this personally), an additional 4,975€ applies.
Additional costs are calculated as 3% of the contract sum = 1,594.22€ (this likely covers travel, postage, etc.; is that reasonable?)
In total, this amounts to 54,734.84€ net. After applying a 15% discount, the net total is 46,524.61€, which corresponds to a gross final amount of 55,364.29€.
What do you think? One thing I notice is that service phase 9 is not included – what could be the reason for that?
Best regards and have a nice weekend! Since HOAI has been only a guideline since January, negotiation is possible here.
Overall, the fee is not cheap compared to the construction costs but not excessive either.
Service phase 9 is usually never carried out.
Research the topic of architect/contractor warranty.
You will find the reason, which is related to the balance between compensation and liability.
If the architect appeals to you both instinctively and in terms of philosophy, why not 🙂
PS: There are HOAI calculators online. Just calculate it yourself.
askforafriend13 Mar 2021 10:39Malunga schrieb:
Since the HOAI has been only a guideline since January, negotiations are possible here.
Overall, the fee is not cheap compared to the construction costs, but also not excessive. The values correspond exactly to the HOAI rates according to the calculator – but with a 15% discount. Are other architects cheaper than HOAI minus 15%? If yes, we would still build with him (but not with discounts of 40% or more).
Malunga schrieb:
Phase 9 (completion phase) is usually never done.
Read up on the topic of architect/contractor warranty.
Then you will find the reason. It is related to the earnings/liability ratio.
Understood!
askforafriend schrieb:
The values are exactly according to the HOAI rates based on the calculators – but with a 15% discount. Are there other architects cheaper than HOAI minus 15%? For us, it will come down to about 10%. So, congratulations 😉
askforafriend schrieb:
What do you think? What I notice is that phase 9 of work is not included – what could be the reason for that?Is it because we are talking about a single-family house?https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
askforafriend13 Mar 2021 14:2711ant schrieb:
Are we talking about a single-family house here?Then let me interpret your rhetorical question as an answer and put the words in your mouth: "For a single-family house, it is absolutely not necessary to agree to the work phase 9 (LPH9)."
Right?
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