ᐅ What to replace an oil heating system from 1989 in an old, characterful house with?
Created on: 9 Jan 2021 14:19
M
meowmeowHello dear forum,
we have an old timber-framed house in the Alpine foreland. Built around 1910 with an extension from the 1960s, the original building has a basement, the extension does not. The insulation is rather poor, and the windows are either double-glazed or old. A hailstorm completely destroyed our roof, so a new roof with good insulation has now been installed.
Currently, we have a Viessmann oil heating system from 1989 with a 2000l (528 gallons) oil tank in the basement, which has caused no major problems so far. The hot water is also centrally supplied by this system. With the old roof, we used about 1900-2500l (502-660 gallons) of oil in winter, depending on the season. With the new roof, we don’t have experience yet, but I expect some improvement. The house has about 115m2 (1238 square feet) of living space, heated by radiators.
Since the heating system is getting old and there are currently larger subsidy programs, we are considering modernization. From my research so far, a heat pump seems to be out of the question because we would need a better-insulated house and underfloor heating? Other types of electric heating seem even less economical?
The least invasive option would probably be a new condensing oil boiler, but these are not subsidized, so I could just wait until the old one breaks down?
A pellet heating system seems too complicated to operate? My mother will soon be 70 and often lives alone in the house. In her old age, I don’t want to put too much strain on her. We frequently visit with our child for several days, but mostly in summer. Also, the long transition phase with low heating loads appears to speak against a pellet system.
I can’t really estimate the costs for gas. A gas connection might be possible with the local supplier if the neighbors join in. We would need about 60-70m (197-230 feet) of gas pipeline on our own property. What costs should I roughly expect? Alternatively, a tank could be buried in the garden, but we are not very enthusiastic about that idea. We are somewhat confused by current politics: on the one hand, fossil fuels are supposed to become much more expensive to promote renewable energy, but on the other hand, gas condensing boilers are heavily subsidized?
For sentimental reasons, we could imagine installing a water-bearing wood stove in the living room. We already have a wood-burning stove in the kitchen where we occasionally cook, and which also provides some heating in winter.
However, it would have to connect to the same chimney currently used by the oil heating system – or the future gas heating system – and from what I understand, this is not allowed, so I might have to give up that dream, right?
We are considering a photovoltaic system on the roof, but we plan to remove the attic floor and renovate the upstairs room within about 5-10 years to get higher ceilings. This would also include adding a few skylights. I should probably wait for these renovation measures first.
What would you recommend? How should the new heating system be sized – I assume this can be calculated quite well based on previous energy consumption?
Thank you very much for your time and help!
we have an old timber-framed house in the Alpine foreland. Built around 1910 with an extension from the 1960s, the original building has a basement, the extension does not. The insulation is rather poor, and the windows are either double-glazed or old. A hailstorm completely destroyed our roof, so a new roof with good insulation has now been installed.
Currently, we have a Viessmann oil heating system from 1989 with a 2000l (528 gallons) oil tank in the basement, which has caused no major problems so far. The hot water is also centrally supplied by this system. With the old roof, we used about 1900-2500l (502-660 gallons) of oil in winter, depending on the season. With the new roof, we don’t have experience yet, but I expect some improvement. The house has about 115m2 (1238 square feet) of living space, heated by radiators.
Since the heating system is getting old and there are currently larger subsidy programs, we are considering modernization. From my research so far, a heat pump seems to be out of the question because we would need a better-insulated house and underfloor heating? Other types of electric heating seem even less economical?
The least invasive option would probably be a new condensing oil boiler, but these are not subsidized, so I could just wait until the old one breaks down?
A pellet heating system seems too complicated to operate? My mother will soon be 70 and often lives alone in the house. In her old age, I don’t want to put too much strain on her. We frequently visit with our child for several days, but mostly in summer. Also, the long transition phase with low heating loads appears to speak against a pellet system.
I can’t really estimate the costs for gas. A gas connection might be possible with the local supplier if the neighbors join in. We would need about 60-70m (197-230 feet) of gas pipeline on our own property. What costs should I roughly expect? Alternatively, a tank could be buried in the garden, but we are not very enthusiastic about that idea. We are somewhat confused by current politics: on the one hand, fossil fuels are supposed to become much more expensive to promote renewable energy, but on the other hand, gas condensing boilers are heavily subsidized?
For sentimental reasons, we could imagine installing a water-bearing wood stove in the living room. We already have a wood-burning stove in the kitchen where we occasionally cook, and which also provides some heating in winter.
However, it would have to connect to the same chimney currently used by the oil heating system – or the future gas heating system – and from what I understand, this is not allowed, so I might have to give up that dream, right?
We are considering a photovoltaic system on the roof, but we plan to remove the attic floor and renovate the upstairs room within about 5-10 years to get higher ceilings. This would also include adding a few skylights. I should probably wait for these renovation measures first.
What would you recommend? How should the new heating system be sized – I assume this can be calculated quite well based on previous energy consumption?
Thank you very much for your time and help!
Is another energy renovation neither planned nor desired?
Are the oil tanks still in good condition?
I would stick with the old system and optimize it a bit. There are good resources on Google about this.
A 60m (200 feet) gas pipeline will probably be very expensive, I guess. The utility provider usually has cost breakdowns: a flat rate up to a certain meter limit, then a price per additional meter.
I'm not a fan of oil and it's uncertain what future governments will do, but here I see oil as an economical option.
Not pellets, but wood gasifiers? That hardly makes sense, as it requires much more work.
Are the oil tanks still in good condition?
I would stick with the old system and optimize it a bit. There are good resources on Google about this.
A 60m (200 feet) gas pipeline will probably be very expensive, I guess. The utility provider usually has cost breakdowns: a flat rate up to a certain meter limit, then a price per additional meter.
I'm not a fan of oil and it's uncertain what future governments will do, but here I see oil as an economical option.
Not pellets, but wood gasifiers? That hardly makes sense, as it requires much more work.
Are the oil tanks still in good condition?
How can I find that out? They were renovated about 10 years ago, at least there is no oil leaking or anything like that.
Hmm, we already had an energy consultant come by, and unfortunately, further energy upgrades did not seem very practical. Gradually, we will probably replace the windows if necessary. Insulation measures appeared to be cost-effective only after about 25–30 years (without interest); after that period, you could likely install new insulation again.
We have small amounts of our own wood that we like to burn from time to time. However, you can’t build a heating concept on that, especially if it has to be operated by someone over 70 years old.
How can I find that out? They were renovated about 10 years ago, at least there is no oil leaking or anything like that.
Hmm, we already had an energy consultant come by, and unfortunately, further energy upgrades did not seem very practical. Gradually, we will probably replace the windows if necessary. Insulation measures appeared to be cost-effective only after about 25–30 years (without interest); after that period, you could likely install new insulation again.
We have small amounts of our own wood that we like to burn from time to time. However, you can’t build a heating concept on that, especially if it has to be operated by someone over 70 years old.
P
pagoni20209 Jan 2021 15:02I would do what seems reasonable to me. First of all, I would exclude the topic of financial incentives. If I still end up there, that’s fine, but I wouldn’t base my decisions primarily on available incentives.
Since you all want or can’t complete all the planned measures right now, I wouldn’t replace a working heating system. Once the issue of photovoltaic systems has been resolved and can be implemented, infrared heating supported by wood or similar sources could be an option. Take a look across the border to Austria, where they are quite innovative in this regard.
Ultimately, as always, it depends on individual needs and benefits. In general, I could also well imagine using liquefied petroleum gas (LPG). Especially older people probably prefer things to be simple and functional.
Since you all want or can’t complete all the planned measures right now, I wouldn’t replace a working heating system. Once the issue of photovoltaic systems has been resolved and can be implemented, infrared heating supported by wood or similar sources could be an option. Take a look across the border to Austria, where they are quite innovative in this regard.
Ultimately, as always, it depends on individual needs and benefits. In general, I could also well imagine using liquefied petroleum gas (LPG). Especially older people probably prefer things to be simple and functional.
Wolkensieben9 Jan 2021 15:05Interesting topic, I’ll join in to read.
We were also planning to install a new type of heating system in grandma’s house because she heats with night storage heaters, which are very expensive.
On the other hand, if you compare the costs of any new heating system, it might not be worth it. It probably won’t pay off (“amortize”) within 30 years, just like you wrote.
A long time ago, each room was heated with individual oil stoves, using small oil cans. That’s why there are still two chimneys in the house. We also considered installing a wood stove in the kitchen and a wood-burning stove in the living room, and investing in new stainless steel flues for the chimneys.
Regarding carrying the wood: I wonder how the old farmers managed. It is tiring, but exercise can be good if you want it. Especially if you bring the firewood in once a day, piece by piece. We preferred to store the wood outside because of pests. (It’s already bad enough when the cat brings in half-alive “gifts” like mice). She would have liked to have stoves.
Our idea was to install a photovoltaic system on the roof with a battery/storage in the basement to power new infrared heaters and the water heater.
But we haven’t finished the calculations yet, the plan is still unfinished, and we don’t know if there is any incentive or subsidy if you don’t improve insulation.
Do you need a building permit / planning permission for a roof conversion?
We were also planning to install a new type of heating system in grandma’s house because she heats with night storage heaters, which are very expensive.
On the other hand, if you compare the costs of any new heating system, it might not be worth it. It probably won’t pay off (“amortize”) within 30 years, just like you wrote.
A long time ago, each room was heated with individual oil stoves, using small oil cans. That’s why there are still two chimneys in the house. We also considered installing a wood stove in the kitchen and a wood-burning stove in the living room, and investing in new stainless steel flues for the chimneys.
Regarding carrying the wood: I wonder how the old farmers managed. It is tiring, but exercise can be good if you want it. Especially if you bring the firewood in once a day, piece by piece. We preferred to store the wood outside because of pests. (It’s already bad enough when the cat brings in half-alive “gifts” like mice). She would have liked to have stoves.
Our idea was to install a photovoltaic system on the roof with a battery/storage in the basement to power new infrared heaters and the water heater.
But we haven’t finished the calculations yet, the plan is still unfinished, and we don’t know if there is any incentive or subsidy if you don’t improve insulation.
Do you need a building permit / planning permission for a roof conversion?
Is a building permit / planning permission required for an attic conversion?
That completely depends on the scope of the conversion and local regulations, for example if dormer windows are planned.
“Especially the older person probably prefers something simple and functional.”
My mother still enjoys working with wood. So not just heating, but also using a chainsaw and chopping wood. We already have a wood stove in the kitchen, but you can’t rely on that staying the same.
That completely depends on the scope of the conversion and local regulations, for example if dormer windows are planned.
“Especially the older person probably prefers something simple and functional.”
My mother still enjoys working with wood. So not just heating, but also using a chainsaw and chopping wood. We already have a wood stove in the kitchen, but you can’t rely on that staying the same.
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