Hello everyone.
Here’s the situation: The house is built (in Cuxhaven), the carport has been chosen and the contract signed. The price is almost 13,000€ (about $14,000).
The carport is a kit and will have space for two cars plus a workshop, covering a total of 50sqm (about 540 sq ft). The manufacturer is Biber Carport from Munich, and the contract includes a clause allowing cancellation if the building permit / planning permission is denied. I have already paid a deposit.
So far, so good.
While researching what is required for the building permit / planning permission application, the building authority said the application must be signed by a “design author” – either an architect or a master craftsman, whoever designed the structure. And, of course, they need a drawing of the carport.
That is clear too.
So I approached the company, which then said they don’t have such a person in-house but use an external expert. They said they would have to check if this person can sign the application because sometimes such signatures imply additional liabilities that cannot be fulfilled remotely, for example, if the design author were assumed to have construction supervision responsibilities. They want more than 500€ (about $540) extra for the drawing.
I can understand the extra cost for the drawing since my carport is custom-made. As for the liabilities related to the building permit / planning permission, I could not find anything in the form about that. It only has a section for the design author’s name, company, etc., and that’s it.
The review process took a long time, so after more than four weeks, I asked whether they were able to sign the application. Otherwise, I would like to exercise my right to cancel the contract. I did not really accept the Corona situation as an excuse since the external review is done by forwarding an email, and I had sent that email a week before the lockdown started in Bavaria.
Now, more than five weeks after submitting the form, they responded that they need more time, citing Corona and other reasons. Also, they said there was never talk of a building permit / planning permission service and that I can only exercise the cancellation clause if I can provide a rejected application.
Funny – how can I get a rejection if they won’t give me the signature I need?!
Long story short: Can anyone explain what the standard responsibilities of a manufacturer are in such a case? To me, that naturally should be part of the product. Meanwhile, they act as if this was an optional convenience service, like a registration service when buying a car. Maybe they haven’t fully understood the situation yet, but that can be clarified. Still: What is normally included in such a product and what counts as an extra service?
Even though I understand the additional charge for the drawing, I think buyers should be made aware of this in advance, especially since the carport is large enough that a building permit / planning permission is needed in every federal state, and therefore a drawing is necessary.
Looking forward to your answers.
Enrico
Here’s the situation: The house is built (in Cuxhaven), the carport has been chosen and the contract signed. The price is almost 13,000€ (about $14,000).
The carport is a kit and will have space for two cars plus a workshop, covering a total of 50sqm (about 540 sq ft). The manufacturer is Biber Carport from Munich, and the contract includes a clause allowing cancellation if the building permit / planning permission is denied. I have already paid a deposit.
So far, so good.
While researching what is required for the building permit / planning permission application, the building authority said the application must be signed by a “design author” – either an architect or a master craftsman, whoever designed the structure. And, of course, they need a drawing of the carport.
That is clear too.
So I approached the company, which then said they don’t have such a person in-house but use an external expert. They said they would have to check if this person can sign the application because sometimes such signatures imply additional liabilities that cannot be fulfilled remotely, for example, if the design author were assumed to have construction supervision responsibilities. They want more than 500€ (about $540) extra for the drawing.
I can understand the extra cost for the drawing since my carport is custom-made. As for the liabilities related to the building permit / planning permission, I could not find anything in the form about that. It only has a section for the design author’s name, company, etc., and that’s it.
The review process took a long time, so after more than four weeks, I asked whether they were able to sign the application. Otherwise, I would like to exercise my right to cancel the contract. I did not really accept the Corona situation as an excuse since the external review is done by forwarding an email, and I had sent that email a week before the lockdown started in Bavaria.
Now, more than five weeks after submitting the form, they responded that they need more time, citing Corona and other reasons. Also, they said there was never talk of a building permit / planning permission service and that I can only exercise the cancellation clause if I can provide a rejected application.
Funny – how can I get a rejection if they won’t give me the signature I need?!
Long story short: Can anyone explain what the standard responsibilities of a manufacturer are in such a case? To me, that naturally should be part of the product. Meanwhile, they act as if this was an optional convenience service, like a registration service when buying a car. Maybe they haven’t fully understood the situation yet, but that can be clarified. Still: What is normally included in such a product and what counts as an extra service?
Even though I understand the additional charge for the drawing, I think buyers should be made aware of this in advance, especially since the carport is large enough that a building permit / planning permission is needed in every federal state, and therefore a drawing is necessary.
Looking forward to your answers.
Enrico
H
HilfeHilfe19 Apr 2020 11:27B.Baumeister schrieb:
Wrong. For the installation, foundation, etc., there is a separate site manager who must be appointed.Ok, and does that mean they do it for free?H
HilfeHilfe19 Apr 2020 11:29Mycraft schrieb:
That’s actually common practice. Architectural services need to be paid for, and not just a little. That surprises me though—I thought a signature didn’t cost anything.
B
B.Baumeister19 Apr 2020 11:38HilfeHilfe schrieb:
That surprises me—I thought a signature didn’t cost anything. Guys—let’s not pretend to be clueless now.
Of course, architectural services do have a cost. But with prefabricated houses/buildings, it’s always a mixed calculation.
For example, I bought a house from Heinz von Heiden and paid a total amount X. Architectural services are naturally included in that, and nobody asks for additional money afterward.
And that’s no different in their case either. Or do small carports that do not require permits suddenly have a surcharge just because they can be built without a signature and therefore no money is earned there?
Whether the site manager gets paid is irrelevant here.
They have completely different responsibilities, which aren’t the topic here at all.
B.Baumeister schrieb:
That's correct, but it should also be listed in an invoice beforehand.No, not always. But you are free to have the carport company bill everything according to the HOAI if you want. Then you will receive all the documentation you require.H
HilfeHilfe19 Apr 2020 11:45B.Baumeister schrieb:
Guys – let’s not pretend to be ignorant here.
Of course, architectural services cost money. But with prefabricated houses/buildings, it’s always a mixed calculation.
For example, I bought a house from Heinz von Heiden and paid a total amount X. Architectural services were obviously included, and no one asks for additional payment afterwards.
It’s the same with them. Do smaller, non-planning-permission-required carports get an extra charge because they could be built without approval and thus no money comes in at that point?
And whether the construction manager gets paid is irrelevant here.
They have completely different responsibilities, which are not the topic here. You don’t understand the core issue. Nationwide, authorities have different requirements for accessory buildings. Most of the time, carports are exempt from needing planning permission/building permits. You found a cheap carport manufacturer but obviously weren’t fully informed and now try to pass the costs onto them. Building permits/planning permissions cost between 500 and 2,000 euros. But it doesn’t surprise me. Anyone building with Heinz von Heiden tries to pinch every penny. Services cost money!
H
HilfeHilfe19 Apr 2020 11:48And one more thing you’re forgetting! If the building permit / planning permission application is incomplete, has issues, or questions arise, who handles it? You or the carport manufacturer?!
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