Hello everyone,
this is my third post in this forum. First of all, thank you for the valuable tips I have already received. I think I have learned a lot so far.
I have linked the previous posts below. To avoid any misunderstandings, I will list all the necessary information again. Therefore, reading the old posts only makes limited sense. For completeness, I have included them here.
https://www.hausbau-forum.de/threads/grundrissplanung-Bungalow-170qm.31445/
https://www.hausbau-forum.de/threads/grobe-Grundstücksplanung-819m.31558/
For the initial selection, there were three rough floor plan drafts. One was from Yvonne, the second from kbt09, and the third from the planner/ourselves. Many thanks to both of you for the good ideas! After some time for consideration and consultation with the developer, we decided to pursue the third floor plan.
Now to the main topic.
At the end of April 2019, we reserved a plot (plot no. 10) and started working on the floor plan. The plot is tied to the developer, and unfortunately, the planner has not turned out to be very creative (myself included). Two weeks ago, we had another meeting with the developer and talked about the three options mentioned above. We then chose one variant and want to proceed with it. We have now received a draft, which certainly still needs improvement.
For this reason, I would like to present the floor plan here again for discussion and hope for feedback, ideas, suggestions, and tips. Maybe you will immediately see things that “just don’t work” or are not practical for everyday life. I have also already noticed a few things that I would change, but since we will probably make quite a few modifications anyway, I have not yet suggested my own improvements in the floor plan. Also, the planner and I have not yet discussed doors and windows.
Attached again is the completed questionnaire.
Development plan/restrictions
Plot size: 819m² (8809 sq ft)
Slope: NO
Floor area ratio (FAR): 0.4 (allowable exceedance 25 per 100)
Gross floor area ratio (GFAR): 0.6
Building envelope, building line and boundary: On the northeast side approximately 31m (102 ft) deep, west side approximately 35m (115 ft) deep, plot frontage on the street 18.7m (61 ft) and rear boundary (development limit) approximately 27m (89 ft). The major challenge with the plot is the narrow width at the front. Depending on house orientation, after the 3m (10 ft) building setback on the street side, we have about 19.5m (64 ft) to 20.4m (67 ft) available. This means that if the house is parallel to the street, it is 19.5m (64 ft), and parallel to the neighbor in the northeast direction about 20.1m (66 ft).
Side building setback: 3m (10 ft)
Number of parking spaces required: no specification
Number of floors: maximum 2 full floors
Roof type: gable roof, hip roof
Other requirements: Garage must be at least 5m (16 ft) from the property boundary.
Client requirements
Style, roof shape, building type: bungalow with hip roof
Basement, floors: no basement due to high groundwater level
Number of people, age: 4 people aged 36 years (female), 37 years (male), 2 years (child), 7 months (child)
Room requirements on ground floor and upper floor:
Ground floor: living/dining/kitchen, utility room, guest toilet with shower, hallway with coat area and stairs to the upper floor, children’s rooms, master bedroom, bathroom, and storage room.
Upper floor: office, children’s playroom and additional storage space.
Office: family use or home office? home office
Overnight guests per year: 1–2 times
Open or closed floor plan: a mix of both
Conservative or modern design: a mix of both
Open kitchen, kitchen island: open kitchen with island would be nice but not a must, closed kitchen also has advantages
Number of dining seats: 4, with the option for 6–8 would be nice but not essential
Fireplace: no
Music/sound wall: sound system in the living room
Balcony, roof terrace: no
Garage, carport: Space for 2 cars is required. Currently, I am considering a garage (3x6m / 10x20 ft) and carport (3.6m / 12 ft).
Kitchen garden, greenhouse: no
Other wishes/special requirements/daily routine, including reasons for preferences or restrictions
House design
Who designed the plan:
-Developer’s planner / do-it-yourself
What do you particularly like? Why?
-There should be enough space in the coat area and behind the stairs to store jackets, shoes, etc.
-The children’s rooms have a comfortable size and are practically equal in size.
-Living room/kitchen are close to entrance and garage.
-The storage room has a good (central) location.
-
What do you not like? Why?
-Garage/carport is very far to the back (but I can probably live with this)
-The utility room is comparatively large and long
-The kitchen in my opinion is somewhat too large
-The living room is only the desired minimum size and could use 5m² (54 sq ft) more
-The main bathroom is located between both children’s rooms and the noise from showering and toilet use is likely to be a major issue
-The main bathroom could be slightly larger
-Between the garage and the property boundary there will be a dead space where weeds will probably grow later. Does anyone have ideas on how to prevent this?
-The garage is currently planned with a length of 9m (30 ft), of which 6m (20 ft) is for the garage and 3m (10 ft) for a storage room. The current position directly behind the garage is not optimal in my view
Price estimate according to architect/planner: no new price estimate received yet
Personal price limit for the house including equipment: 400,000
Preferred heating technology: heat pump
Why is the design the way it is now? e.g.
ideas from planner and do-it-yourself ideas from me
What is the most important/basic question about the floor plan summarized in 130 characters?
The main bathroom is located between the children’s rooms. How can we reduce noise disturbance to a minimum?
Imagine I drive a Skoda Superb into the garage. Since the garage is on the property boundary and the driveway narrows between the house and property line, I have to enter at a slight angle. Does this cause problems in everyday life? See pictures.
Assuming we build a double garage directly attached to the bungalow instead of a garage and carport, is there anything special to consider during construction?
this is my third post in this forum. First of all, thank you for the valuable tips I have already received. I think I have learned a lot so far.
I have linked the previous posts below. To avoid any misunderstandings, I will list all the necessary information again. Therefore, reading the old posts only makes limited sense. For completeness, I have included them here.
https://www.hausbau-forum.de/threads/grundrissplanung-Bungalow-170qm.31445/
https://www.hausbau-forum.de/threads/grobe-Grundstücksplanung-819m.31558/
For the initial selection, there were three rough floor plan drafts. One was from Yvonne, the second from kbt09, and the third from the planner/ourselves. Many thanks to both of you for the good ideas! After some time for consideration and consultation with the developer, we decided to pursue the third floor plan.
ypg schrieb:
If I say that the plot is not easy, I am understated.
Maybe this is an approach?
kbt09 schrieb:
I continued with the approach from the floor plan adjustments.
Now to the main topic.
At the end of April 2019, we reserved a plot (plot no. 10) and started working on the floor plan. The plot is tied to the developer, and unfortunately, the planner has not turned out to be very creative (myself included). Two weeks ago, we had another meeting with the developer and talked about the three options mentioned above. We then chose one variant and want to proceed with it. We have now received a draft, which certainly still needs improvement.
For this reason, I would like to present the floor plan here again for discussion and hope for feedback, ideas, suggestions, and tips. Maybe you will immediately see things that “just don’t work” or are not practical for everyday life. I have also already noticed a few things that I would change, but since we will probably make quite a few modifications anyway, I have not yet suggested my own improvements in the floor plan. Also, the planner and I have not yet discussed doors and windows.
Attached again is the completed questionnaire.
Development plan/restrictions
Plot size: 819m² (8809 sq ft)
Slope: NO
Floor area ratio (FAR): 0.4 (allowable exceedance 25 per 100)
Gross floor area ratio (GFAR): 0.6
Building envelope, building line and boundary: On the northeast side approximately 31m (102 ft) deep, west side approximately 35m (115 ft) deep, plot frontage on the street 18.7m (61 ft) and rear boundary (development limit) approximately 27m (89 ft). The major challenge with the plot is the narrow width at the front. Depending on house orientation, after the 3m (10 ft) building setback on the street side, we have about 19.5m (64 ft) to 20.4m (67 ft) available. This means that if the house is parallel to the street, it is 19.5m (64 ft), and parallel to the neighbor in the northeast direction about 20.1m (66 ft).
Side building setback: 3m (10 ft)
Number of parking spaces required: no specification
Number of floors: maximum 2 full floors
Roof type: gable roof, hip roof
Other requirements: Garage must be at least 5m (16 ft) from the property boundary.
Client requirements
Style, roof shape, building type: bungalow with hip roof
Basement, floors: no basement due to high groundwater level
Number of people, age: 4 people aged 36 years (female), 37 years (male), 2 years (child), 7 months (child)
Room requirements on ground floor and upper floor:
Ground floor: living/dining/kitchen, utility room, guest toilet with shower, hallway with coat area and stairs to the upper floor, children’s rooms, master bedroom, bathroom, and storage room.
Upper floor: office, children’s playroom and additional storage space.
Office: family use or home office? home office
Overnight guests per year: 1–2 times
Open or closed floor plan: a mix of both
Conservative or modern design: a mix of both
Open kitchen, kitchen island: open kitchen with island would be nice but not a must, closed kitchen also has advantages
Number of dining seats: 4, with the option for 6–8 would be nice but not essential
Fireplace: no
Music/sound wall: sound system in the living room
Balcony, roof terrace: no
Garage, carport: Space for 2 cars is required. Currently, I am considering a garage (3x6m / 10x20 ft) and carport (3.6m / 12 ft).
Kitchen garden, greenhouse: no
Other wishes/special requirements/daily routine, including reasons for preferences or restrictions
House design
Who designed the plan:
-Developer’s planner / do-it-yourself
What do you particularly like? Why?
-There should be enough space in the coat area and behind the stairs to store jackets, shoes, etc.
-The children’s rooms have a comfortable size and are practically equal in size.
-Living room/kitchen are close to entrance and garage.
-The storage room has a good (central) location.
-
What do you not like? Why?
-Garage/carport is very far to the back (but I can probably live with this)
-The utility room is comparatively large and long
-The kitchen in my opinion is somewhat too large
-The living room is only the desired minimum size and could use 5m² (54 sq ft) more
-The main bathroom is located between both children’s rooms and the noise from showering and toilet use is likely to be a major issue
-The main bathroom could be slightly larger
-Between the garage and the property boundary there will be a dead space where weeds will probably grow later. Does anyone have ideas on how to prevent this?
-The garage is currently planned with a length of 9m (30 ft), of which 6m (20 ft) is for the garage and 3m (10 ft) for a storage room. The current position directly behind the garage is not optimal in my view
Price estimate according to architect/planner: no new price estimate received yet
Personal price limit for the house including equipment: 400,000
Preferred heating technology: heat pump
Why is the design the way it is now? e.g.
ideas from planner and do-it-yourself ideas from me
What is the most important/basic question about the floor plan summarized in 130 characters?
The main bathroom is located between the children’s rooms. How can we reduce noise disturbance to a minimum?
Imagine I drive a Skoda Superb into the garage. Since the garage is on the property boundary and the driveway narrows between the house and property line, I have to enter at a slight angle. Does this cause problems in everyday life? See pictures.
Assuming we build a double garage directly attached to the bungalow instead of a garage and carport, is there anything special to consider during construction?
Evolith schrieb:
The appealing aspect of a bungalow is that the interior walls are non-load-bearing and can be arranged flexibly. Be careful, this is not generally true! It also depends on the roof structure and usually applies only to houses around the 80 m² (860 sq ft) size range, where exceptions are rare. As long as the statement basically means that there is no reinforced concrete ceiling to support on the upper floor, this also applies (with the same limitation as before) to “town villas”; therefore, interior walls there are also often drywall partitions.
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
Chrisi1906 schrieb:
Who designed the floor plan?
Where you have the pull-down attic ladder, are you planning to install a proper staircase there later, or will it stay as it is?
I quickly modified the floor plan a bit based on the wishes we have:
- Larger kids’ bedrooms
- Guest toilet with shower
- Slightly bigger master bathroom
- Office under the roof
I would change the room layout. Your bedroom has the best sunlight exposure to the southwest, although you probably won’t use it for activities that require a lot of daylight.
Children, especially in their teenage years, will spend a lot of time in their rooms during the day — reading, playing, doing homework. Their rooms should therefore ideally have a southeast or southwest-facing window.
I would place the bathroom and bedroom on the northwest side, which also results in shorter routes for fresh water and wastewater pipes. Swap those with the kids’ bedrooms and arrange them so that each has at least one southwest-facing window. This might reduce the currently very large open living and dining area.
The guest toilet should be a bit larger so that the shower fits well. I wouldn’t skip the shower, especially since teenagers often spend a long time in the bathroom getting ready. When everyone has to leave the house at the same time, it can become very stressful if one person blocks the bathroom for a long time and the next needs just as much time.
ltenzer schrieb:
I would change the room layout. Your bedroom has the best southwest exposure to the sun, although you probably won’t use it for activities that require a lot of daylight.
Children tend to spend a lot of time in their rooms during the day at the latest when they are teenagers—reading, playing, doing homework. Their rooms should therefore ideally have a southeast or southwest-facing window.
I would place the bathroom and bedroom on the northwest side, which also results in shorter pipe runs for fresh water and wastewater. Swap these with the children’s rooms and arrange them so that each has at least one southwest-facing window. This might come at the expense of the currently very large living-dining area.
The guest toilet should be a bit larger to properly fit a shower. I wouldn’t skip the shower, especially since teenagers often spend considerable time getting ready in the bathroom. When everyone needs to leave the house at the same time, it can be very stressful if one person blocks the bathroom for a long time and the next person needs just as long. We’ve already gone through all this… we’re on page 46! A lot of effort has gone into this.
C
Chrisi190614 Jan 2020 22:09ltenzer schrieb:
I’m currently wondering whether I’d rather be a child or the washing machine in your family. As the washing machine, I’d have a smaller room but with a sunnier southeast-facing location.
The children’s rooms are located in the southwest in the latest floor plan. That fits well.
Evolith schrieb:
The hatch is by the children’s room doors. Later, when the kids have moved out (that will easily take another 18 years since the youngest just turned 1), one of the children’s rooms will be opened up and the staircase will be placed there. The appeal of the bungalow is also that the interior walls are non-load-bearing and can be rearranged in various layouts.
Regarding your suggested rearrangements:
The size of the children’s rooms is really sufficient, surprisingly enough. You just have to be a bit creative with the furniture during their childhood years, but thanks to Pinterest and other resources, that’s quite easy. With my son, I often rearrange the furniture depending on what and how he prefers to play at the moment. Later during the teenage years, they basically only need a bed, wardrobe, and desk since they don’t move around as much.
Forget about the shower in the guest toilet; you won’t be able to fit one in. So far, we haven’t needed it either. Even with guests, we’ve never been pressed for space.
You can keep the main bathroom size as it is. That’s absolutely enough! I can send you a photo if you like.
I would reconsider having the office under the roof. See if you can place it downstairs instead. That way, you’d save the staircase and a lot of wasted space caused by the stairs.
If you close off our kitchen "niche," you have your office. Then remove the partition wall in the living room, and you can decide whether to put the kitchen along the office wall or where our living room currently is. Some people like to look out to the garden while cooking. Our floor plan certainly has enough space for that. At the moment, our "office" is on the back side of the partition wall facing the kitchen.
You can hardly make the bedroom any smaller; otherwise, there won’t be any room left to get past the bed—unless you’re so creative that you build your bed recessed into the wall at the back.
By the way, you won’t be able to fit the staircase there. The space simply isn’t enough unless you build a 20-meter (65.6 feet) wide bungalow.
Edit: Oh, the floor plan was drawn up by a construction company we shortlisted. We modified it slightly for ourselves. Having the office under the roof was the case with nearly all our floor plans, so that’s why I kept it here too. We would save the stairway, but the office is definitely larger than the stairs. You’re right about the shower in the guest WC; it’s difficult to fit. Right now, we don’t need the shower in the guest WC, but maybe when the kids are older? I don’t know... At the moment, my kids are still small, and everything gets done together anyway. As for the bedroom, I wouldn’t want it any smaller either.
Chrisi1906 schrieb:
The children's rooms are in the southwest in the last floor plan. That fits, doesn’t it? I was referring to the floor plan in #267. Isn’t that the most recent one?
Your entrance is on the northeast side, right? And the children’s rooms in #267 would then be on the northwest side? Or have you now moved the entrance to the northwest side facing the street?
C
Chrisi190614 Jan 2020 22:30kbt09 schrieb:
You could share some wall dimensions ... and then roughly indicate the layout of the rooms, for example in the 62 sqm (667 sq ft) living room with the kitchen positioned as far as possible from the terrace.
The bedroom looks a bit tight in depth, as does the corridor width ... and is there space for a wardrobe?
Also, won’t the living/dining area be quite dark? The west-facing sun definitely won’t reach there anymore – right?
Have you placed the bungalow on the site plan? On the street side, there probably isn’t much clearance left on either side. For example, see "my" corner bungalow in post 139, which was planned almost the other way around.
I also liked the rectangular bungalow from post 92, as well as several of Katja’s designs.
While skimming through, your subwoofer and noise concerns also caught my attention again.You’re right about the standard dimensions. It’s difficult like this, but I need a bit more time for it. I’m still not quite sure if the house will fit width-wise on the plot. I’ll take a closer look at it over the weekend.
I also find the bedroom tight, and you’re right about the corridor as well. But if you want more space there, some rooms have to be located on a second floor.
Thanks a lot for pointing out that the living/dining area might be dark. I wouldn’t have noticed that if you hadn’t mentioned it.
ltenzer schrieb:
I would change the room arrangement. Your bedroom gets the best sunlight exposure from the southwest, although you probably won’t use it for activities that require a lot of daylight.
Kids, especially in their teenage years, will spend a lot of daytime in their rooms—reading, playing, doing homework. Their rooms should therefore preferably have a southeast or southwest window.
I would place the bathroom and bedroom on the northwest side, which also results in shorter routing for fresh water and wastewater pipes. Swap these with the kids’ rooms and arrange them so that each child has at least one southwest-facing window. This might come at the expense of the currently very large living-dining area.
The guest WC should be a bit larger to fit a shower comfortably. I wouldn’t give up that shower, since teenagers often spend a long time getting ready. When everyone needs to leave the house at the same time, it can quickly become stressful if one person occupies the bathroom forever and the next one needs just as long.I would prefer the bedroom on the southeast side. In the latest floor plan, it’s more toward the south to southwest.
The kids’ rooms are already located on the southwest side.
If you place the bathroom and bedroom on the northwest side, the utility room won’t be on the northwest side anymore, which means it would no longer be at the front of the plot. Does it have to be at the front? No.
We only have boys, and although I also spent time getting ready as a teenager, it never took more than 10 to 15 minutes. Including a shower is a safe bet, though, so the plan was to include one in the guest WC.
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