Hello everyone!
My husband and I are in the early stages of planning our house. We had to submit a preliminary house plan to our local municipality (Salzburg Land/Austria) on short notice due to certain requirements. We developed this plan together with our designer with very little preparation time.
We have a somewhat unusual floor plan, in our opinion, featuring a setback on the ground floor, and we mainly want to hear your opinions about this. Our primary concern is whether we have taken a completely absurd approach or if we can build on this basic idea. Our biggest issue is that so far we haven’t seen a single house with this type of floor plan (neither online nor in real life, at least around Salzburg and nearby ...) and naturally, we wonder why. Does it have any significant disadvantages? Does it look strange in any way?
We look forward to your feedback and are already very grateful for your constructive criticism and especially your time to help us.
Now to the questionnaire:
Development plan / Restrictions
Plot size 920 m² (9,900 sq ft)
Slope Elevated plot, gently sloping on three sides
Owners’ requirements
Style, roof type, building type rural-modern, gable roof, two-family house
Basement, floors Basement, 2 full floors, attic
Number of occupants, ages Currently three (28, 29, and 8 months old) with 1-2 more children planned
Space requirements on ground and upper floors
Ground floor: spacious open kitchen with integrated pantry, dining area, living room, WC, bathroom, office (later a bedroom)
Upper floor: 3 children’s bedrooms, family bathroom, WC
Attic: master bedroom with bathroom and an additional room (extra bedroom / hobby room)
Ground floor + upper floor approx. 200 m² (2,150 sq ft); attic size not yet finalized
Office For family use and later bedroom
Kitchen L-shaped with cooking island and wood stove
Number of dining seats 6-8, possibly extendable table for more space
Fireplace Yes – planned as a room divider between living room and "common room"
Balcony Balcony on the first floor – should eventually be large enough for the second family
Garage Small garage for 1 vehicle and a larger garage for 2 vehicles
House design
Planned by:
Designer from a construction company
What do you particularly like? Why?
Cost estimate according to architect/designer not yet available – only a preliminary draft
Personal budget for house including fixtures and fittings 350,000 € (with a lot of personal labor)
Preferred heating technology Heat pump
If you had to give up something, which features/finishes
- Could give up: attic expansion initially, but want to keep the possibility for future use
- Cannot give up: a cozy and large kitchen/dining area is very important to us
Why does the design look the way it does?
The most important aspect of our planning is that the house can be converted into a two-family home in the future when one of our children would need it, earliest in 20–25 years. That would mean one living unit on the ground floor and a second on the first floor plus the attic.
The office planned on the ground floor would then be used as a bedroom. The staircase can be completely separated with a (already marked) wall but is intended to remain open until then.
The attic is planned to house the master bedroom with bathroom. This is where the plan shows the biggest weaknesses for us: the bedroom is too large, and the bathroom is too small. This definitely needs to be changed.
Why sleep in the attic? There is not enough space on the ground floor, and we want to keep privacy from the children’s bedrooms so that when our kids are older and have friends/partners visiting, everyone can have their own space. We know this might be inconvenient with small children/babies due to additional distances, but since children’s bedrooms 1 and 2 are relatively large, siblings could share a room, and bedroom 3 could serve as a “backup bedroom” for us. We are only planning for two children but you never know!
If later children’s bedrooms 1 and 2 become kitchen/living areas, there would then be one bedroom on the first floor and two more in the attic.
What we particularly like is the idea of the split-level living room. We are aware that opinions on this are very divided and most experts discourage it. However, the level difference is only 36 cm (2 steps), and we believe it will be manageable even as we get older.
What is the most important/basic question about the floor plan in 130 characters?
We would really like to know from you:
My husband and I are in the early stages of planning our house. We had to submit a preliminary house plan to our local municipality (Salzburg Land/Austria) on short notice due to certain requirements. We developed this plan together with our designer with very little preparation time.
We have a somewhat unusual floor plan, in our opinion, featuring a setback on the ground floor, and we mainly want to hear your opinions about this. Our primary concern is whether we have taken a completely absurd approach or if we can build on this basic idea. Our biggest issue is that so far we haven’t seen a single house with this type of floor plan (neither online nor in real life, at least around Salzburg and nearby ...) and naturally, we wonder why. Does it have any significant disadvantages? Does it look strange in any way?
We look forward to your feedback and are already very grateful for your constructive criticism and especially your time to help us.
Now to the questionnaire:
Development plan / Restrictions
Plot size 920 m² (9,900 sq ft)
Slope Elevated plot, gently sloping on three sides
Owners’ requirements
Style, roof type, building type rural-modern, gable roof, two-family house
Basement, floors Basement, 2 full floors, attic
Number of occupants, ages Currently three (28, 29, and 8 months old) with 1-2 more children planned
Space requirements on ground and upper floors
Ground floor: spacious open kitchen with integrated pantry, dining area, living room, WC, bathroom, office (later a bedroom)
Upper floor: 3 children’s bedrooms, family bathroom, WC
Attic: master bedroom with bathroom and an additional room (extra bedroom / hobby room)
Ground floor + upper floor approx. 200 m² (2,150 sq ft); attic size not yet finalized
Office For family use and later bedroom
Kitchen L-shaped with cooking island and wood stove
Number of dining seats 6-8, possibly extendable table for more space
Fireplace Yes – planned as a room divider between living room and "common room"
Balcony Balcony on the first floor – should eventually be large enough for the second family
Garage Small garage for 1 vehicle and a larger garage for 2 vehicles
House design
Planned by:
Designer from a construction company
What do you particularly like? Why?
- “Split-level” living room – in our opinion, this creates a visual separation between the kitchen/dining area and is our little “highlight.” The living room remains a distinct living space and doesn’t get cluttered with toys because the common room offers plenty of space.
- “Common room” – this refers to the area between the living room and kitchen in front of the terrace door – lots of space for children to play and creates an open atmosphere while keeping the living room somewhat separated. Where a sofa is drawn, a fireplace with a reading corner as a room divider is also planned.
- Setback at the terrace – seating area covered and wind-protected with privacy screening. The resulting floor plan (where the living room is not directly adjacent to the kitchen and dining area as in many open-concept designs) is something we like.
- The office is intended to become our bedroom later, but in our opinion, it is currently too small for that.
- Main entrance is in the basement – spatially, the floor plan doesn’t allow for another solution; otherwise, the entrance would be on the back of the house, which we do not like. However, there is certainly another entrance on the ground floor for easier access when bringing in groceries, so you don’t have to carry everything through the basement.
- The cloakroom in the basement is still too small but can be easily enlarged – just mentioning this in case someone notices.
Cost estimate according to architect/designer not yet available – only a preliminary draft
Personal budget for house including fixtures and fittings 350,000 € (with a lot of personal labor)
Preferred heating technology Heat pump
If you had to give up something, which features/finishes
- Could give up: attic expansion initially, but want to keep the possibility for future use
- Cannot give up: a cozy and large kitchen/dining area is very important to us
Why does the design look the way it does?
The most important aspect of our planning is that the house can be converted into a two-family home in the future when one of our children would need it, earliest in 20–25 years. That would mean one living unit on the ground floor and a second on the first floor plus the attic.
The office planned on the ground floor would then be used as a bedroom. The staircase can be completely separated with a (already marked) wall but is intended to remain open until then.
The attic is planned to house the master bedroom with bathroom. This is where the plan shows the biggest weaknesses for us: the bedroom is too large, and the bathroom is too small. This definitely needs to be changed.
Why sleep in the attic? There is not enough space on the ground floor, and we want to keep privacy from the children’s bedrooms so that when our kids are older and have friends/partners visiting, everyone can have their own space. We know this might be inconvenient with small children/babies due to additional distances, but since children’s bedrooms 1 and 2 are relatively large, siblings could share a room, and bedroom 3 could serve as a “backup bedroom” for us. We are only planning for two children but you never know!
If later children’s bedrooms 1 and 2 become kitchen/living areas, there would then be one bedroom on the first floor and two more in the attic.
What we particularly like is the idea of the split-level living room. We are aware that opinions on this are very divided and most experts discourage it. However, the level difference is only 36 cm (2 steps), and we believe it will be manageable even as we get older.
What is the most important/basic question about the floor plan in 130 characters?
We would really like to know from you:
- Is there a name for this floor plan style (like L-shaped or U-shaped)?
- What do you think in general about the idea of the setback? We like the idea of having a covered terrace area and the resulting floor plan. We haven’t seen houses or floor plans like this before (if at all, only with bungalows) and wonder why? Does nobody like it, or are there disadvantages we are overlooking? Do you have experiences with sunlight exposure – will it be a problem that the setback measures 3.5 m (11.5 ft) from the balcony edge to the terrace door?
- Even though we love the idea, we would appreciate experiences and opinions on the split-level living room.
- Would you build the wall separating the common room from the living room (shown as 1.20 m (4 ft) high in the plan) all the way to the ceiling?
- Suggestions and ideas for the office/bedroom on the ground floor – how could the layout be changed to make the room at least 5 m² (54 sq ft) larger?
G
goldmarieeeee6 Jun 2019 11:40Altai schrieb:
Over the weekend, I also saw a solution where a child (with their partner) builds a duplex with their parents. The parents’ half is slightly smaller, but both halves match stylistically. The entire building was coherent. In my opinion, only the “child’s part” (they are already an adult) would be like that as well.
The parents had a living area, bedroom, bathroom, but unfortunately only a very narrow kitchen without natural light, which I didn’t like. Otherwise, it was an 80m² (860 sqft) two-room apartment.
Maybe it’s worth considering whether such a solution is possible? Building the family home you need now while planning the retirement living space regarding location on the plot, etc., and constructing it when the time comes? Thanks for your idea—I had thought about that too, but unfortunately my husband doesn’t like it at all. He insists on extending only upwards! Some friends of ours are currently expanding an existing house that way, and I think that’s a great solution!
G
goldmarieeeee6 Jun 2019 11:50Two more questions for you –
Do you have any recommendations for a free design software? We want to create some initial drafts ourselves before going back to the architect. Is it even advisable to return to the same architect, or is he already too “set” on the current plan? I should add that we initially came to him with our own drawn plan, and he based his design quite closely on our concept.
Is that a good or bad approach? Or would it be better to just give the architect a written outline of our ideas so he can develop his own design without any “preconceptions”?
I’d appreciate any tips on how you have handled this!
Do you have any recommendations for a free design software? We want to create some initial drafts ourselves before going back to the architect. Is it even advisable to return to the same architect, or is he already too “set” on the current plan? I should add that we initially came to him with our own drawn plan, and he based his design quite closely on our concept.
Is that a good or bad approach? Or would it be better to just give the architect a written outline of our ideas so he can develop his own design without any “preconceptions”?
I’d appreciate any tips on how you have handled this!
The best free planning tool is not online, but usually found on your desk or in a drawer: graph paper, pencil, and eraser.
Such software often creates the illusion with nice visuals that everything is aligned – but reality is different.
Start with graph paper by drawing the building envelope, writing down the room program (already mentioned here several times), and then start sketching. Eventually, a basic shape will emerge. Then it’s time to bring in the furniture. Cut out appropriately scaled paper models that you can freely move around – something no software I know allows as easily.
Once you are fairly far along, you can use a program like Sweet Home 3D to model the design digitally – then you can view it in 3D and virtually walk through the rooms. But this only makes sense when the actual planning is already well advanced. It takes quite a bit of time to properly enter everything into the computer.
We have found a roll of tracing paper very useful, which you can lay over the current plan to experiment with different options without starting over each time – I can highly recommend this.
Bays, corners, projections: all a matter of cost – if you are already budgeting, this would be the first place I would save.
Houses with a simple, rectangular floor plan are not necessarily boring boxes.
If we had been able to build as we wanted, our house would look very different (truly Bauhaus style with a stepped upper floor, flat roof, cubist, minimal). Instead, due to the given constraints, we have a rectangular house with a pitched roof – certainly not what we originally imagined. But I do not find our house boring at all.
So be open to everything and don’t reject something upfront just because you found it dull before; look at everything with an open mind. At this stage, visiting show home villages is always interesting. There you can experience firsthand what suits you, what really won’t work, what surprisingly works great, and what unfortunately isn’t as cool as you might have thought. I would definitely recommend that!
Such software often creates the illusion with nice visuals that everything is aligned – but reality is different.
Start with graph paper by drawing the building envelope, writing down the room program (already mentioned here several times), and then start sketching. Eventually, a basic shape will emerge. Then it’s time to bring in the furniture. Cut out appropriately scaled paper models that you can freely move around – something no software I know allows as easily.
Once you are fairly far along, you can use a program like Sweet Home 3D to model the design digitally – then you can view it in 3D and virtually walk through the rooms. But this only makes sense when the actual planning is already well advanced. It takes quite a bit of time to properly enter everything into the computer.
We have found a roll of tracing paper very useful, which you can lay over the current plan to experiment with different options without starting over each time – I can highly recommend this.
Bays, corners, projections: all a matter of cost – if you are already budgeting, this would be the first place I would save.
Houses with a simple, rectangular floor plan are not necessarily boring boxes.
If we had been able to build as we wanted, our house would look very different (truly Bauhaus style with a stepped upper floor, flat roof, cubist, minimal). Instead, due to the given constraints, we have a rectangular house with a pitched roof – certainly not what we originally imagined. But I do not find our house boring at all.
So be open to everything and don’t reject something upfront just because you found it dull before; look at everything with an open mind. At this stage, visiting show home villages is always interesting. There you can experience firsthand what suits you, what really won’t work, what surprisingly works great, and what unfortunately isn’t as cool as you might have thought. I would definitely recommend that!
Later, you can use the basement space as a bedroom or partition it off and build the dining table into a kind of conservatory as an extension.
I would start planning from scratch.
1. Room layout
- Which rooms do I need,
- What is the current use (possibly future use as well, though that is secondary),
- Special furniture (size matters)
For example: home office / guest / craft / gaming room,
desk and shelf for your husband, guest bed, one cabinet for your craft supplies, cutting table 2 x 1 m (6.5 x 3.3 ft), etc.; location within the house does not matter.
Bedroom
You want or have a bed that you really like. The frame isn’t just 2 x 2 m (6.5 x 6.5 ft) but quite thick, so the bed measures 2 x 2.2 m (6.5 x 7.2 ft).
You need 3, 4, or 5 meters (9.8, 13.1, or 16.4 ft) of wardrobe space.
This determines the room size.
2. Sketch on graph paper, ruler, and pencil—1 cm = 1 meter (1 inch = approximately 3.3 ft) is sufficient.
Then try it out:
draw in the furniture,
move walls,
start over if needed.
There are online references for how much space a table or a staircase requires.
Is the planner from a general contractor?
Pre-drawn plans make the work easier. Simply trace, consider static calculations, and you’re done. The client is satisfied; there is little effort.
I would go to the planner with a room layout that lists all your requirements. Not just “wardrobe,” but how many linear meters (feet) you need; not just “kitchen,” but kitchen with peninsula, etc.
Also state that you don’t want a bay window / oriel, etc.
I would start planning from scratch.
1. Room layout
- Which rooms do I need,
- What is the current use (possibly future use as well, though that is secondary),
- Special furniture (size matters)
For example: home office / guest / craft / gaming room,
desk and shelf for your husband, guest bed, one cabinet for your craft supplies, cutting table 2 x 1 m (6.5 x 3.3 ft), etc.; location within the house does not matter.
Bedroom
You want or have a bed that you really like. The frame isn’t just 2 x 2 m (6.5 x 6.5 ft) but quite thick, so the bed measures 2 x 2.2 m (6.5 x 7.2 ft).
You need 3, 4, or 5 meters (9.8, 13.1, or 16.4 ft) of wardrobe space.
This determines the room size.
2. Sketch on graph paper, ruler, and pencil—1 cm = 1 meter (1 inch = approximately 3.3 ft) is sufficient.
Then try it out:
draw in the furniture,
move walls,
start over if needed.
There are online references for how much space a table or a staircase requires.
Is the planner from a general contractor?
Pre-drawn plans make the work easier. Simply trace, consider static calculations, and you’re done. The client is satisfied; there is little effort.
I would go to the planner with a room layout that lists all your requirements. Not just “wardrobe,” but how many linear meters (feet) you need; not just “kitchen,” but kitchen with peninsula, etc.
Also state that you don’t want a bay window / oriel, etc.
W
WilhelmRo6 Jun 2019 13:20goldmarieeeee schrieb:
Do you have any recommendations for a free floor plan software?Sweet Home 3D
Everyone has their own opinion; for example, I am in favor of it.
Climbee schrieb:
Such programs often create the illusion that everything fits perfectly through nice visuals – but reality is different.Nonsense – and a 1mm (0.04 inch) pencil line doesn’t create any illusions?Use real measurements, for example, exterior wall 36cm (14 inches), interior wall 17.5cm (7 inches).
You’ll have to figure out the rest yourself (for example, you can look up stair dimensions here). Otherwise, a simple Google search for "kitchen island dimensions" will give you a good idea of how to draw things.
Best regards
goldmarieeeee schrieb:
do we have to completely discard this plan nowIt is better to start fresh than to do patchwork and repairs.
Take a look here:
https://www.hausbau-forum.de/threads/leitfaden-zur-hausplanung-auf-dem-Grundstück.30891/
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