Hello everyone, I hope some experts here can offer me some advice. We are about to start building a single-family house. We have received several quotes from different construction companies. Each company recommends a different type of exterior wall construction, so I would like to ask for your opinion.
I am aware that this topic has been discussed many times before, but I can only find outdated information online.
The house will be built in Fürth (Bavaria). The location is relatively quiet, but there is a highway about 400 m (440 yards) away, which is barely audible from outside. The interior walls are planned to be made of sand-lime bricks.
The following materials have been proposed for the exterior walls:
- 36.5 cm (14 inches) aerated concrete (0.09)
- 36.5 cm (14 inches) porous fired clay bricks (0.10), laid with lightweight masonry mortar LM 21
- 17.5 cm (7 inches) sand-lime bricks combined with an external thermal insulation composite system (ETICS) of 150 mm (6 inches). This involves attaching rigid foam panels with a fiberglass mesh reinforcement layer to the outside of the masonry.
- Poroton T8, T7
- Liapor SL, Liapor, Super-K-Plus, etc.
I would appreciate any help and advice in making this decision.
Thank you in advance for your valuable support!
I am aware that this topic has been discussed many times before, but I can only find outdated information online.
The house will be built in Fürth (Bavaria). The location is relatively quiet, but there is a highway about 400 m (440 yards) away, which is barely audible from outside. The interior walls are planned to be made of sand-lime bricks.
The following materials have been proposed for the exterior walls:
- 36.5 cm (14 inches) aerated concrete (0.09)
- 36.5 cm (14 inches) porous fired clay bricks (0.10), laid with lightweight masonry mortar LM 21
- 17.5 cm (7 inches) sand-lime bricks combined with an external thermal insulation composite system (ETICS) of 150 mm (6 inches). This involves attaching rigid foam panels with a fiberglass mesh reinforcement layer to the outside of the masonry.
- Poroton T8, T7
- Liapor SL, Liapor, Super-K-Plus, etc.
I would appreciate any help and advice in making this decision.
Thank you in advance for your valuable support!
P
PowerBauer24 Jul 2017 12:15To avoid opening yet another thread, I’ll just join this one. Our builder offers the following options:
The builder recommended sand-lime brick plus EPS because they said it provides better soundproofing, aerated concrete tends to crumble, and bricks require special anchors for mounting things and are prone to cracking. I rather think economic reasons played a role and that sand-lime brick plus EPS is simply cheaper for the builder to provide.
I liked the properties of perlite-filled Poroton bricks, but they are in a completely different price range, and it’s questionable whether the builder would even agree to use a completely different system.
- 20cm (8 inches) sand-lime brick with 16cm (6 inches) EPS insulation (polystyrene? Mineral wool also available for an extra cost)
- 36.5cm (14.5 inches) aerated concrete
- 36.5cm (14.5 inches) Ytong (which is also aerated concrete, right?)
- 36.5cm (14.5 inches) EDER brick (XP9)
The builder recommended sand-lime brick plus EPS because they said it provides better soundproofing, aerated concrete tends to crumble, and bricks require special anchors for mounting things and are prone to cracking. I rather think economic reasons played a role and that sand-lime brick plus EPS is simply cheaper for the builder to provide.
I liked the properties of perlite-filled Poroton bricks, but they are in a completely different price range, and it’s questionable whether the builder would even agree to use a completely different system.
B
Bieber081524 Jul 2017 12:38The provider’s arguments are valid, even if it would be economically best for them.
Lighting fixtures and motion sensors can be easily installed using insulation anchors for external thermal insulation composite systems (ETICS) (BTDT). Awnings are typically anchored in the concrete intermediate floor slab (if available), otherwise in the masonry. In that case, calcium silicate bricks outperform the other mentioned options (although there are solutions for those as well).
If you prefer monolithic construction, then you should also build monolithically.
Lighting fixtures and motion sensors can be easily installed using insulation anchors for external thermal insulation composite systems (ETICS) (BTDT). Awnings are typically anchored in the concrete intermediate floor slab (if available), otherwise in the masonry. In that case, calcium silicate bricks outperform the other mentioned options (although there are solutions for those as well).
If you prefer monolithic construction, then you should also build monolithically.
First of all, is high sound insulation really necessary? What is the location of the house like, is there a lot of traffic outside? Otherwise, I wouldn’t care about it at all.
From what I heard: I asked our builder about savings and whether it would be possible to use Porit aerated concrete instead of Ytong, since it is cheaper. He rejected that. The statement was: Porit is cheaper, true. It is supposed to be equivalent to Ytong. In practice, Ytong is straighter, less crumbly, and the blocks arrive on site in better condition. Porit causes more trouble for the masons. That’s why Ytong. Karsten
From what I heard: I asked our builder about savings and whether it would be possible to use Porit aerated concrete instead of Ytong, since it is cheaper. He rejected that. The statement was: Porit is cheaper, true. It is supposed to be equivalent to Ytong. In practice, Ytong is straighter, less crumbly, and the blocks arrive on site in better condition. Porit causes more trouble for the masons. That’s why Ytong. Karsten
P
PowerBauer24 Jul 2017 13:06Thank you for the quick and informative responses.
Bieber0815 schrieb:It's more of a feeling and because I've read a lot in the forum where ETICS (external thermal insulation composite systems) is often criticized. Personally, aside from the fastening issue, I'm relatively unbiased...
If you prefer monolithic construction, then you should also build monolithically.
Nordlys schrieb:Yes, it probably shouldn’t be overlooked. The house will be on a main road where the official noise map shows about 60-65 dB (at the planned building site; it’s louder directly at the road).
First of all, is high sound insulation really necessary? Location of the house, a lot of traffic in front? Otherwise, I wouldn’t really care.
PowerBauer schrieb:
The supplier recommended sand-lime brick plus EPS insulation because it offers better soundproofing. I completely agree!
Another advantage is that you get a lot of mass inside the house. This is better for both summer and winter. In summer, the brick can absorb a lot of heat. It takes much longer for the indoor temperature to become uncomfortably warm (when outdoor temperatures exceed 30°C (86°F)).
PowerBauer schrieb:
It's more of a gut feeling, and because I’ve read a lot in the forum where ETICS is regularly criticized. That’s because the critics of ETICS are very loud and mostly repeat old prejudices without practical experience.
There aren’t many ETICS users who speak negatively about it. Why do you think that is?
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PowerBauer24 Jul 2017 13:55tempic schrieb:
And another advantage: you get a lot of mass inside the house. This is better in both summer and winter. In summer, the masonry can absorb a lot of heat. It takes significantly longer for the indoor temperature to become unbearably hot (at outdoor temperatures above 30°C (86°F)). Oh, okay. That was actually another advantage of the monolithic construction in my opinion, since according to the U-value calculator, the time lag is much longer there (EDER brick: 24h vs sand-lime brick + EPS insulation: 10h). Or am I interpreting that wrong?
tempic schrieb:
There are not many owners of external wall insulation systems (EWIS) who speak negatively about it. I wonder why? Not many admit to having made such a serious bad decision, see the fox and the grapes ;-D
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