Hello everyone,
My wooden house is nearly complete, and I want to handle the wiring myself. I will have the builder’s electrician show me where to run the cables, which beams I am allowed to drill through, etc., but the circuit breaker panel, outlets, and so on will be installed by the electrician.
The challenge starts already with sourcing the materials and choosing the cables.
- Expert 1 (architect and trained electrician): A 5x1.5mm² (with 13A breaker) feed line to each room, then from there 3x1.5mm² cable to lights and outlets. Reason: Less material, smaller breaker panel, less work.
- Expert 2 (master electrician): 3x2.5mm² cable to each room for outlets and 3x1.5mm² to each room for lighting. Outlets protected by a 16A breaker. His reason: If the outlet breaker trips, the lights remain on, and the outlets have a higher load capacity.
- Expert 3 (master electrician): For himself, he would choose expert 2’s option. He could live with expert 1’s option, but then with a 5x2.5mm² feed line and then 3x2.5mm² to outlets and 3x2.5mm² to lighting.
My goal is, of course, to save costs and reduce work. Since I plan to treat each room separately, it seems unlikely that a 1.5mm² line with a 13A breaker would be overloaded. You’d have to run a TV, 2000W vacuum cleaner, hairdryer, lights, and radio all at the same time in one room for something to happen, right? Seems unlikely, doesn’t it? My father used to combine several rooms on one circuit in his old house, and breakers only tripped every few years. Then you just go to the basement with a flashlight and reset the breaker... done!
Of course, major appliances have their own circuits, and the stove has a thicker cable, which is logical.
As a non-expert, I don’t see a need for multiple breakers/circuits in every room. But are there any professionals here who have a different opinion?
Regards,
Tito
My wooden house is nearly complete, and I want to handle the wiring myself. I will have the builder’s electrician show me where to run the cables, which beams I am allowed to drill through, etc., but the circuit breaker panel, outlets, and so on will be installed by the electrician.
The challenge starts already with sourcing the materials and choosing the cables.
- Expert 1 (architect and trained electrician): A 5x1.5mm² (with 13A breaker) feed line to each room, then from there 3x1.5mm² cable to lights and outlets. Reason: Less material, smaller breaker panel, less work.
- Expert 2 (master electrician): 3x2.5mm² cable to each room for outlets and 3x1.5mm² to each room for lighting. Outlets protected by a 16A breaker. His reason: If the outlet breaker trips, the lights remain on, and the outlets have a higher load capacity.
- Expert 3 (master electrician): For himself, he would choose expert 2’s option. He could live with expert 1’s option, but then with a 5x2.5mm² feed line and then 3x2.5mm² to outlets and 3x2.5mm² to lighting.
My goal is, of course, to save costs and reduce work. Since I plan to treat each room separately, it seems unlikely that a 1.5mm² line with a 13A breaker would be overloaded. You’d have to run a TV, 2000W vacuum cleaner, hairdryer, lights, and radio all at the same time in one room for something to happen, right? Seems unlikely, doesn’t it? My father used to combine several rooms on one circuit in his old house, and breakers only tripped every few years. Then you just go to the basement with a flashlight and reset the breaker... done!
Of course, major appliances have their own circuits, and the stove has a thicker cable, which is logical.
As a non-expert, I don’t see a need for multiple breakers/circuits in every room. But are there any professionals here who have a different opinion?
Regards,
Tito
Take a look, this topic was already discussed around midday today: https://www.hausbau-forum.de/threads/elektrikverteilung-so-standesgemaess.24348/
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https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
Definitely professional 2 if you want to do it according to the current state of technology. Nowadays, 3 x 2.5 mm² (3 x 8 AWG) wiring is installed for outlets. This is not only related to what you plug in but also to the cable length.
Besides, in 5 years you might want to connect a heater or something else to such an outlet.
Besides, in 5 years you might want to connect a heater or something else to such an outlet.
dohuli schrieb:
Definitely professional 2 if you want to do it according to the current state of technology. Nowadays, outlets are wired with three times 2.5 mm² (about 3 AWG) conductors. This is not only about what you plug in, but also about the cable length. Besides, in five years you might want to connect a heater or something else to one of those outlets.Regarding cable length: That’s why with 1.5 mm² (about 16 AWG) cable you use a 13 A fuse instead of a 16 A, right?
I wonder how often it actually happens that everything in a room is used at the same time and the power exceeds 2500 W.
Would you then have two fuses per room (one for outlets and one for lighting) or would you combine the lighting circuits of several rooms?
Regardless of whether it makes sense or not, I also want to have residual current devices (RCDs) in the children's rooms and bedrooms. So I would need two fuses and two RCDs in those rooms. Also, I’m not sure if I might want to install arc fault circuit interrupters (AFCIs) in the future. Right now, they are still quite expensive, but if in a few years they cost around 30 € (about 30 USD), then I would also need two AFCIs for each room. The breaker panel would eventually be as large as my entire pantry.
Therefore, my goal was actually to combine lighting and power per room on a single 1.5 mm² (about 16 AWG) feeder circuit with a 13 A fuse. That way, I would only need 3 instead of 6 residual current devices and maybe only 10 AFCIs instead of 20. Plus, the space I would save.
You are considering ground-fault circuit interrupters (GFCIs) but only want to use 1.5 mm2 (about 15 AWG) wiring?!
I am a trained electrician and a graduate electrical engineer. Although I am not working professionally in the construction industry, I am quite well informed about this topic since I am currently building my own house.
However, I had the installation planning done by a professional planner.
For each large room, I will install one circuit for lighting (1.5 mm2 (about 15 AWG)) and one for outlets (2.5 mm2 (about 13 AWG)). Smaller rooms will be grouped together (hallway, guest bathroom, etc.). Regarding load, for example, in the living/dining room: Hi-Fi system, TV, floor lamp (300 W), perhaps a raclette or electric grill, and you are already well above 2500 W.
I am a trained electrician and a graduate electrical engineer. Although I am not working professionally in the construction industry, I am quite well informed about this topic since I am currently building my own house.
However, I had the installation planning done by a professional planner.
For each large room, I will install one circuit for lighting (1.5 mm2 (about 15 AWG)) and one for outlets (2.5 mm2 (about 13 AWG)). Smaller rooms will be grouped together (hallway, guest bathroom, etc.). Regarding load, for example, in the living/dining room: Hi-Fi system, TV, floor lamp (300 W), perhaps a raclette or electric grill, and you are already well above 2500 W.
dohuli schrieb:
You’re considering using RCDs, but only want to install 1.5 mm2 (15 AWG) wiring?! Are these two things mutually exclusive? Is the risk of a house fire higher with 1.5 mm2 (15 AWG) and 13A than with 2.5 mm2 (14 AWG) wiring and 16A?
dohuli schrieb:
I will run one circuit for lighting (1.5 mm2 / 15 AWG) and one for outlets (2.5 mm2 / 14 AWG) in each large room; smaller rooms will be combined (hallway, guest WC, etc.). So you connect outlets to the next larger room’s circuit, and lighting as well?
dohuli schrieb:
Regarding load, for example, living/dining room: Hi-Fi, TV, floor lamp (300 W), maybe a raclette or electric grill – and you’re well above 2500 W already. The large living/dining/kitchen area would be protected by two circuits for the standard connections (stove and major appliances on separate circuits).
I understand what you mean, but except for “the fuse might trip sometimes” and “then you’re sitting in the dark,” I don’t see a strong reason. That is acceptable to me and has happened about five times in my homes and apartments over the last 30 years. If the concern were that the cable would overheat and ignite the wood fiber insulation, that would be different – but as a non-professional, I see little cause for worry since I would only use a 13A fuse.
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